Winpop, if you want to criticize Chummy, you'll need to use WAY smaller words. Think "hooked on phonics" for the socially retarded. Then dumb it down a little more. No, more than that. Think mud, or a bag of hammers, or a dozen GWB's. in a phone booth.
yeah, but it's not a bunch of dead fish mushed up as bait. And Gargamel was actually a great wizard, the smurf show was biased!
The smurfs where part of his cure for cancer... if you can't see that then the media has YOU by the balls. jeje
Leave out a small contraction out (oops!, my mistake) and all the flea-biting c**k-suckers rise up just like dragging a C-note through a trailer park. I told Chumm maybe that wasn;t a good name, Chummin, but I guess I was wrong. With you girls I could bait...wait, let's see...the baboon cage at the zoo...with mere words. Ha!
Or were you more offended at being called Democrats..or maybe useful idiots? But I repeat myself. Cheers girls
chum 2 noun chopped fish, fish fluids, and other material thrown overboard as angling bait. • refuse from fish, esp. that remaining after expressing oil. verb [ intrans. ] use chum as bait when fishing. ORIGIN mid 19th cent.: of unknown origin.
All you guys are missing the point here.
If you know semaphore, you'll see that the young Iraqia are spelling out the following message to their trainers.
"You macho American idiots jumping up and down with your stupid exercises - do you really think you can beat us - the next time you see us we will have explosives under our shirts - Allah is good."
Yet another Glumbert video which kinda shows what I've been saying all along.
Some time back, I asked another poster on these threads, who went by the name of "usmcvet" (I think), as to why it takes eight to ten weeks to put a Marine through basic infantry.....yet it's taking almost 5 YEARS to train the Iraqis to stand up for themselves? Or, for that matter, why/how thirteen raggedy colonies managed to get organized enough to break free of a world empire? Well, the answer to this is sooooooo simple: one can NOT instill freedom for a peoples, unless those peoples have the spirit of that ideal within THEMSELVES. Because if this was true in the Iraqis case, then I would have seen numerous IED's, mines, suicide attackers and snipers all throughout the tenure of Saddams reign. But there were none. And that's because of one of two reasons: they didn't mind him all that much.....or they simply didn't care one way or another. And please...don't give me any of this horseshit about them being "too afraid of dying", or being "killed"; George Washington and his crew took humongous casualties in their struggle, simply because the cause was just and right. But the assholes in this video can't even get organized to do jumping-jacks, fer fuck sakes.
Once more:
You can NOT give anyone something they are NOT ready to to obtain (i.e. fight for), for themselves.
And the sooner Stream and his right-wing, bloodthirsty, ignorant, kill-crazy, Bush-apologist fuckheads realize this, then the sooner young American kids can stop dying for a gutless, cowardly, opportunistic Iraqi populace.
That's really easy if you've ever worn a uniform of anything other than a rent-a-cop agency. A seriou question only for the seriously deficient in how the world works. You can train a kid to shoot, kill etc in no time. But you can't create command, control, or any sense of mission i less than 1-2 years, minumum. Look, it took Canada 153 years, and they're still working it.
Tweedle-Dumbest, you've finally begun to cost me research time. If that was your aim, you win. For while you try to get your masters in history cutting and pasting the first paragraph of just about everything Wikipedia and Google have to offer, I have to spend my time now searching through thesauri for new ways to define stupid, as cretin, moron, ignoramous just don't quite get it done anymore. Even Dante could not have contrived a pit in hell so deep as to be able to hold your pride in imbelicity. No libel ever accused you of even a scintila of brainpower. You and randal should form a history book club, as I saw where a nice lot of Junior Illustrated Classics were up for bid...just the starter kit you girls needs.
But as for Iraqi soldiers, there's not an American GI who's been in uniform over 2 years who couldn't dispatch your comments in under three sentences, expletives deleted. Every GI knows how long it takes to become a well oiled fighting unit...minimum three years....in a battle-free environment. (Our assault troops in WWII were all cannon fodder, not campaign winners.) Washington was a horrible example for you to use as he got his ass kicked out of New York and Philadelphia, in the first two years while he was trying to get his troops trained. His mission wasn't exactly the same as either ours or the Iraqis, but there were similarities. Washington had a holding-the-line victory at Trenton and a couple of modest defeats and ties in 1877. What he was trying to do was contain the Brits (your uncles) while other generals and troops (he hadn't trained) moved the Brits out of the Carolinas (Camden, Kings Mountain, etc) and the West (George Rogers Clark) and even the St Lawrence, (Champlain...Benedict Arnold was, after all, Washington's best general until he flipped). That done, they all squeezed, resulting in Yorktown, Fall, 1781....with the help of the French, who at least offered to shed blood on American soil for Americans..sort of.) Note the date. 1781. Once trained, Washington's troops fought no major egagements for over two years. They contained. They were a threat just by being there and they kept the Brits bottled up. Well oiled units only fight battles of their choosing, and if you'd quite reading 2005 blogs as if they were written last week, you'll note there hasn't been any serious negative comments about the battle readiness of Iraqi military units in over a year, maybe more. (Their police units suck, but don't confuse them, unless on purpose.) Point is, they are doing just fine in what their mission is, which is to contain gained territory. Seems to eb working as US units and Brits have left entire areas of Iraq to the new military. True, we train and they are trained differently that perhaps Canadian troops, who only bark when the UN holds out some Kibbles and Bits. You're only domestic strategy is hold off the Peruvian Navy if it heads north against Dartmouth and Halifax, (nice towns, by the way, i'd hate to see them speaking Spanish someday), just long enough that Toronto, Hamilton and Ottawa can all move west of the red River. I don't think you have a strategy on paper about the Kitaiskis moving east. You just don't understand real military planning or strategy. You set yourself out as being a wise old analyst when in fact all you have proved yourself to be is a bosun's mate on a ship of fools.
Canuck always great to hear your sanity in these times we live!:)
Now on to tarded matters!
HUZZAH...Chum
Your history lesson on actual fact is almost on point,Leaving me to believe you're not the same idiot who stated earlier the Emancipation Proclamation had nothing to do w/ the American civil war But as I read on my doubts returned, and that you in fact are the same dolt!?(crosses finger) Or that you just did a bit of reading like i suggested. Arnold was perhaps our best general? But alas, Loyalty counts for everything! so it is now Nathanael Greene who that right belongs. unarguable!
THREE YEARS minimum to become a well oiled fighting unit??? DUDE! where do you get your facts! Yes, Some units do train that long! But we refer to these as ..(now follow along)..S.P.E.C.I.A.L..forces!!! Is that what we're doing ? We're training the whole Iraqi army to be special forces!?
Try to remember this also. Who do you think we're training anyway? you think these guy have no combat experience! Most of the Iraqi have plenty of former training! and a lot of them have more combat experience then our own troops!
I know you pretend to abhor the idea of googling, but try to lower your self proclaimed standards, and do so, Iran Iraq war! shouldn't be to hard to find it, only lasted ten years or so!
Canuck is right about the spirit needed to fight for freedom, or the right just to exist! What it boils down to is no matter how much time we spend over there,or how many of my brothers and sisters die there, We are going to leave!!! And when we do, the result will be the same. A Civil war won by the Iranian backed unholy warriors! All made possible by the good people who brought us this war,The monkey president Himself, his minions and puppet masters!
I don't pretend to Know the hearts and minds of the Iraqi fighting (or otherwise) mind? But I do Know the only similarity betwixt MY country and the country of Iraq and the two wars, is people are getting killed and they're Americans! Thats the only similarity! Or did we All miss something here in the U.S ? Did a certain group of mullahs form some constitution and proclaim separation of church and state that we're unaware of here? perhaps they declared independence from Saddam and were well into their war of independence when we decided to bring our navy in w/ little loss of life on our part and help out?
Cause thats not reality, is it now? NO...it's not! They're no similarities between our war for independence and...well, our occupation of iraq!
If you feel so Gung-ho over spilling some blood why not drag your ass over there and quit hiding behind georges dress? Don't answer!we all know what it is.
One more thing !You accuse people of googling some facts on matters at hand! Who doesn't?, You do! LOL!
And if there is a ship of fools, I'm sorry to say but we all are sailing it, you people who post under the name Chummin as well!!!
Everytime I write Canuck directly he sends his little sister.
The fact that you didn't know that Arnold was probably our best field general (the invasion of Quebec, Champlain) tells me even more loads about you that I had already figured out. Glad you got all that stuff off your chest, only no one cares...at least among the strangers who might come on this site. I'm just here to remind them who knows what about what. They can decide on their own. That's how it works in a free country. It will not be the case when your guys get control. (That's the part you ain't figured out yet...you'll be the first one eaten. Again, read a little history..especially what happens to dupes. I'm here trying to save your life and all I get is grief. Damn!) As for strapping on the uniform, I already did my time, 5 years, in fact. An ossifer, to boot. (Wow! Double-damn.) A much loved officer, I might add. I won't even argue the idiocy of how long a division trains to become a working fighting force. Since small unit tactics is all they do on video games, i guess you think you have it all figured out. Sorry, pal. By the way, almost none of the Iraqis had prior fighting experience as the military was disbanded and most of then never re-signed. The vast majority were/are from the streets. Besides, we don't have any MOS's for rape and pillage in our army. You just stay under your bed and we'll keep defending your right to be stupid.
The only thing the US Army defends in Iraq is the right to get access to cheap oil.
Go do some reading about the history of the Iraq, this will help you understand why violent measures will never work there. The Brits should have known better, they already did a "short interdiction".
Chummin wields a frying pan, too.
We can certainly agree to disagree about the inateness of a yearning for Freedom. You think it is not inherent to humanity. Ok. I think that is ludicrous, Canuck. You ignore so much cultural context when gusting absurb. We are not instilling or imbuing the yearing for Freedom...only trying to release what has been suppressed. Or, do you disagree that a democratic Middle East is a good thing? (Your logic, if you call it that, is flawed: You did not see (read "nazi") IEDs, etc during Saddam's reign for similar reasons they were absent in Germany and the Soviet Union...poor people and suppression do not lend themselves to that type of retaliation. It has generally taken the help of others. (Gosh, I seem to remember that being a humanitarian argument.)
Now, you usually don't need my help sounding stupid and self-contradictory, but...(This is what you just wrote:
"Once more:
You can NOT give anyone something they are NOT ready to to obtain (i.e. fight for), for themselves."
Brilliant One: does that include welfare checks and free medicine?
Mr. The Bug: I suppose because others have failed, the US should not try.
Your right, as usual...violence won't work in Iraq...what they need is a stern talkin'-to. I propose we send Joan Baez, Bruce Springsteen and Robert Redford.
Since you seem to have avoided your own stupidity, Let us once again try and address your as almost always tarded comment!
THREE YEARS minimum to become a well oiled fighting unit??? DUDE! where do you get your facts! Yes, Some units do train that long! But we refer to these as ..(now follow along)..S.P.E.C.I.A.L..forces!!! Is that what we're doing ? We're training the whole Iraqi army to be special forces!?
Try to remember this also. Who do you think we're training anyway? you think these guy have no combat experience! Most of the Iraqi have plenty of former training! and a lot of them have more combat experience then our own troops!
I know you pretend to abhor the idea of googling, but try to lower your self proclaimed standards, and do so, Iran Iraq war! shouldn't be to hard to find it, only lasted ten years or so!
Streamlined, I just hope that the USA is not going to try the same stunt again with Iran. The middle east is sufficiently instable as it is now, another civil war would not be a good idea.
As for trying: What exactly do you think was the objective? Finding weapons of mass destruction? Spreading democracy and peace? Or getting access to cheap oil?
Neither did work very well so far, but a few large companies made a good deal.
It takes less then three years to train soldiers? ... So we enlist and train for couple of months and then sit around for 10-20 years and when war comes up were bad ass disciplined soldiers?
This isn’t the game Call to Duty. Training is constant and non stop. We have soldiers training before war, during war and after war. There is a reason when the American forces are the most trained and most elite forces in the world. And I am not talking about Special Forces.
Show me a force that trains less then three years. Point out some units please because I am confused.
And Basic training doesn’t spit out soldiers like your fantasy. It only prepares a new soldier to live a life and train as a soldier...
Those who are plunged into war their whole life doesn’t make them well oiled soldiers. Look at Somalia. They fought longer then any vet we have alive. They fought since they were younger then 12. But 12 US Rangers and 5 Delta force killed 1000 fighters...weird considering according to you that these Rangers only have 3 years of training and less experience then the enemy.
Anyone else just now understand why Canada’s armed forces still used dog sleds?
Where were you stationed? What branch of the service were you in?
Me,,Marine corps 13/12 weeks Parris Island then maybe 1 year in your specified M.O.S...or field! And thats it!!! Any thing else is special training!
And to insult Canada shows just what you really are and what you truly believe in!
Now you're saying we need to train the whole of iraq, for what!, another 8 YEARS !!??? Give it a break! I thank God every morning ,noon,night and in between that you and your people are now a smaller majority then what you used to be! Shows me that some people are waking up and turning away from their third world beliefs.
Please Don't Piss down our backs and tell us its raining!!
Psalm! if your motive for supporting and cheering the sending of my brothers and sisters to die or become maimed for life so you can feel better about whatever it is you need to feel better about yourself is?
Why not take chimmpum and go there yourself and quit murdering my countrymen !!
Bug...thanks.
Hasn't been a civil war yet. At least the folks there don't seem to think they're in one.
Remember, these things take time. Can't just download victory or microwave it. It takes patience, diligence and courage.
Better double check all that about no WMD's...not quite as simple as the Euro press and American press would have it.
All those reasons, to some extent, were motives for what we are doing there. If I ran goes down a certain path, Germany and France (mark my words here) will bo on board for military action.
Thanks, Psalms...keep it up. Some people just don't and really won't get it.
streamlined, we have been over your bad selection of information sources before.
Did you ever even try to understand anything outside your obviously very narrow horizon? You think that you do have answers for anything, but you don't even understand the questions.
Bug...you are hurting when Canuck agrees with you.
You have not been over my sources. I wish you would. You showed yourself to be pretty smart once before...don't trip over stupidity now.
Keep talking and denying. Not seeing the vacuousness in your position(S) keeps you in one small place.
Stream, I have been over such soruces before, I don't need to check more of the bullshit that is manufactured to justify the Iraq war. I also don't need to go over the same stuff that is now manufactured to discredit Iran.
I am well aware that you are one of the stupid US Americans who don't understand shit about anything that is happening outside Heckensack, Texas (fortunately not all your fellow citizens are that stupid).
Do you know anythign about the history of the middle east? Do you know any people from there? Do you have any idea about their culture?
Obviously you don't, you are even getting the facts about your own (short) history in the USA wrong.
Buggered...please educate me. If it is like any of your previous arguments, it will be as full of logical bumps as the phrenology you rely upon.
Glad to know I am one of the stupid Americans. Enjoy your security.
Tides they are a-turning.
Please correct me, kinder. Bitte. Tell me of my heritage that you know about.
Yeah, you are right, tides are turning, at least it seemed like that when I was in the USA this summer. People start to realize that Bush and his minions are criminals and that it is not unpatriotic to think and demand your rights. Maybe, just maybe, this wave of change will also reach the remote backwater part of the country you seem to live in.
Stream'o'BS you really are a piece of work. Reading your little cut and parries, with the occassional break to give A.R.S.E soul a reach-around is something to behold. It also makes one laugh...
Hey! At least we're keeping you online and not letting you out in the big wide (flat) world you live on. You can do little harm here. Your type have done lots already to the US though...
Buggery- You misunderstand to whom you condescend. Your pinky waving friends aren't part of the turning tide. I meant, and you know this, the turning of tides around the world. Enjoy being on the wrong side of history...again, Bug. (This will make your second go-round in the last 60 years.) Still waitng on my history lesson.
Hi Mako...A little ice would be good for the skillet wounds. Canuck is currently taking your lumps.
Not from where I'm standing he ain't Streamy... He's pretty much showing you the way, as is Bug.
That's why you fall back to referencing theoretical frying pans and hooting on about people using the internet to source information.
According to you every single article posted on the internet is skewed away from your world view as part of some conspiracy normally attributed to 'lefties'.
No conspiracy mate - you're just a little behind the times
Thanks, Mako
You still struggling with the whole reading thing? You'll notice that I criticize Canuck's ONLY use of the internet and THEN eviscerate many of the articles as to their content.
You have not posted accordingly.
Nor can you.
Once you, Canuck and Buggered get the whole "criticizing 'A' doesn't necessarily mean support for 'B' " idea, then you might make it.
Flagg,, it bothers me that possibly Canuck has dirty pictures of you, or something like that. It bothers me that you seem you to jump every time he snaps his fingers. But no matter. This will be my gift to you...
...in 1976 I read everything I could on the American Revolution, as a matter of civic pride. It was not my favorite period. (The Civil War was....and I had a major in History.) There was a guy named Dale Van Every who wrote a trilogy : Forth to the Wilderness, Company of Heroes and Ark of Empire...he had written some novels so could tell a tale, keep it straight (w/footnotes...they didn't have Google then, c1960) and still make it interesting. He was one of the last of "classical historians" in American academe who didn't have a political ax to grind with their books. (You'll find books prior to 1968 are more merited on that account than those afterwards...on any subject.) About Arnold, this is way before your time, but there was a Pulitzer prize Winner named Kenneth Roberts who wrote a famous novel of Rogers Rangers (French and Indian War)) taking history and inserting fictional characters into the story of the campaigns. It was called Northwest Passage. (Great film, Spencer Tracy, 1940, and when i saw it I read everything I could on the original Rangers.) I suggest you read it, because it was considered one of the best works of fiction that stayed true to history. Roberts, however, was a Tory, living in NE somewhere and he wrote a series on novels on Arnold, the first called Arundel about the Quebec campaign..all of which is true as I double checked it about 25 years ago. he even published a non-fiction book on his background papers (March to Quebec), much of which no one had ever seen in the US. I always liked guys who didn't buy into the myths ...without first proving them. Roberts taught me a lot. Anything that's important check it out yourself...something you girls need to do if you want credibility here. (Google won;t do...just trips to the library.) I accept anybody's opinions as opinion, and politely, but I accept NO ONE's opinions stated AS FACT. Gain humility about all you don;t know and you are treated accordingly. In any case, Roberts taught me a lot, and he did a follow up to Arundel called Rabble in Arms about the Champlain campaigns. Again, my research shows that Roberts was correct about Arnold's role, Roberts hated the Continental Congress, which went against American myth in the 1940s-50s. He was probably right, but his bottom line, which may or may not have been true--he claimed to have a letter from Arnold after he moved to England, was that he believed America should be free and democratic, but with that bunch of mountebanks in Philadelphia running things, it wasn't time. (I feel the same way about Pelosi, Reid and Hollywood running the Congress...so I understood his anger about poiticians, although I don't agree with his bottom line). But I'm a good enough historian and was trained to be critical back in atime when that was "in". Now it's "out" as we all know with global warming, or Gayness being a choice.
I don't know how quickly you read, or ingest good, interesting material that's over 2 pgs long and doesn't have pictures, but those books should still in the library (free) or on Amazon for under a buck (I checked). Kick back, read them, empathize. Read them and enjoy. Then get back to me in 3-4 months. i'll be here. Cheers
...then quit pissing on the shoulders you're lounging on.
Since you seem to have avoided your own stupidity, Let us once again try and address your as almost always tarded comment!
THREE YEARS minimum to become a well oiled fighting unit??? DUDE! where do you get your facts! Yes, Some units do train that long! But we refer to these as ..(now follow along)..S.P.E.C.I.A.L..forces!!! Is that what we're doing ? We're training the whole Iraqi army to be special forces!?
Try to remember this also. Who do you think we're training anyway? you think these guy have no combat experience! Most of the Iraqi have plenty of former training! and a lot of them have more combat experience then our own troops!
I know you pretend to abhor the idea of googling, but try to lower your self proclaimed standards, and do so, Iran Iraq war! shouldn't be to hard to find it, only lasted ten years or so!
(dropped a paragraph) Suit yourself. We fight wars with divisions, brigades, regular TOE units. You seem to think wars are fought like Halo. Pick out any film clip from WWII, soldiers fighting building to building, against snipers. Urban warfare. Each of those soldiers belonged to squad, having been sent there by a lieutenant platoon leader. He got his orders from a company commander, and he from a battalion commander...all the way up. All of them were part of a single coordinated unit...even as they had to make it up as they moved forward(which only Americans can do by the way). Special Forces don't do that, but then again, special forces don't win wars. Dumb Ass.
Like I said, any 2 year troop could/would tell you you're full of shit, but beside that, your Big Sister Symp was inferring that we couldn't train the Iraqis as fast as Washington did. (only Washington didn't. He won the war by not engaging the Brits in open battle.) We're ahead of Washington's schedule in Iraq. It could be that your generation just wants wars to be like your movies...to be over in 90 minutes...just like Halo. I doubt you're in for much of anything for the long haul...all the more to pity about you. Still, what does Sister Symp have on you? It must be biggggg!
Humility! Great word coming from you or your boyfriend!
You really don't have a pair do you? I post under a name of a fictional caricature from a book! I also post on my own not w/ several other people! Seems you need more help then I first suspected!
If you Knew anything about My country and its history... more to the point American civil war,you would never had made the comment about the Emancipation Proclamation having nothing to do w/ the American civil war!
That just Shows you to be a lier!
But i expected nothing more from a few nut jobs from another country who support the jerk in the white house! Oh you can close your American history for dummy's book now, the truth is out!
Plus good come back on the whole on the whole training of soldier thing by the way! your analogy was about as far off...Well, as should be expected I suppose!
My suggestion remains if you are so gung-ho on fighting in Iraq then please go and fight!
Ps the whole Northwest passage thing, I was born on the mohawk River in a little down trodden and economically depressed town known as amsterdam N.Y! I'm also spending yet another thanksgiving in a town called Schuylerville right outside Saratoga! If you read a little further in that book you have propped open in front you, you may find out why those name and or towns mean something! So welcome to my neck of the woods! LOLOLOL!
While you are trying to catch up on my country and its history! I have been all over this land I live in! and the last 40 years immersed in its people and history!! unlike your cramming 40 minutes to reply to any comment to I may see fit to respond to.
Nice try tho! really, A masters in American history LOL! Tell me, who buys the Bullshit you peddle? Anyone ?
RF...You and Chummin seem to have a history about the civil war. What thread and what context?
What are you suggesting about the Civil War vis a vis the Emancipation Proclamation? Surely you are not suggesting that it started the War of Northern Aggression?!
Heres what I dragged over! and I jumped in this debate when Canuck stated that Mr. Lincoln's Emancipation proclamation turned the tide in the war, I disagreed w/Canuck! I strongly do not believe it was that act that was to turn the war around for the federal army And it wasn't the "key" factor in starting the war either!
For you see,, I can still disagree w/ the people's who's opinions i respect without it turning into some bullshit pissing match!
(chummin 1 month ago The Emancipation proclamation had nothing to do with the war as it only freed slaves in Kentucky and Maryland, maybe Missouri, I can't remember. There;s all kinds of books out there. Read one. I'll even send you one of you'll send me a name/address.)
Say what you will stream!, but that comment is the biggest contradiction as of yet! a bit oxymoronic if you will!
RF-
Thanks. With what I know of the War of Northern Aggression, I cannot disagree with Chummin there. What, specifically, is wrong with what he said? How is it contradictory? What were you two arguing?
Twice you used the term war of northern aggression. No? At the end there if you notice! For its not a question!
I,m not biting. It just occurred to me that your from the south! LOL, If you had stated this earlier then i must not have seen it! Or it slipped my mind.
Do you know if any of your ancestors fought in the Rebellion?
I'll tell you something though! The Rebellious states had a point when it came to states rights! I think they were right about the federal government being to strong!
If only they could have just let their slaves free... But then we no that wasn't in the cards.
The war was lost from the beginning for the south, most didn't expect to win! Only to make it bloody enough to let the Union release them!
Who knows, if Kansas weren't brought in as a free state then I would be having this exchange w/ your house servant(fill name in here!).......... ?
Thank god For Crazy old John Brown and Bloody Kansas huh!?
Oh I was born on the Mohawk, But grew up 1/4mile over from the burial grounds of Brown,sons and friends.
You're really losing sleep over that, aren't you? Good. Read a book, as I keep recommending. More than one. You seem to have an inquiring mind...only you don't know nothing, as old Hodge used to say. All you're doing is throwing a good old fashioned Scarlett O'Hara foot-stomping teat fit because you can't have your way in this issue. Let it go, move on, Dot Org. Is your whole generation this way? Be a man....instead of a mere male.
Again I have no idea who're you're arguing with. Surely not me.
Yes I do!! I know exactly who I'm schooling! Your a misinformed adolescent , No Friends, No fun, no understanding of what happened in American history or what's happening in the world around him now for that matter!
Kid, you can make up all sorts of shit in your head then put it down on these threads!, but its never going any any of the filth that you spew from your brain true!
RF- Thanks for some clarity. BTW--did you all kill that awful gator...there at Lake Placid?
There are a lot...and I mean A LOT...of misconceptions about the War of Nawthen Aggression (WoNA).
1) That it was about slavery. It largely was not. Slavery was dying its own economic death in the South and the Southern business-types knew this but sure as heck weren't going to have a Fed gubment tell them what to do...which was unConstitutional. Further, no nawtherner took up arms to fight for the noble cause of freeing the slaves. The racism of the north took a more subtle form. (BTW-the Abolitionist movement was a Christian movement that influenced public policy--in case mako or canuck is reading.)
2) That State's rights = a desire to keep and maintain slavery. Nope. No dirt poor southerner (who didn't own slaves) took up arms to keep slaves. The Southern anger for the Fed Gubment is warrented since it had no authority to act in the manner it did, altough it clearly had te power. Secession was an option to all States and, at the time, was not seen as something over-the-top.
3) Lincoln could not have cared less about slavery except in its capacity to break up the Union (He had some strong positons about the South's ability to trade with Europe, independent of the North). The EmanProclam did not apply to all slaves...only the ones living in the Confederacy. The slaves that Lincoln did control (800,000 of them) living within captured Confed territory and in Delaware, Maryland, Kentucky, Missouri and parts of Tennessee were left out of the EmanProclam. (Lincoln knew he had NO constitutional right or legal justification.)
Those are my favorite (3), but there are more...and our Fed Gubment is too big.
John Brown--Some rich Northerners funded and armed John Brown...who was purposefully trying to start a race war. So, just 25 or so years after Nat Turner's revolt, the Northern Press was calling for immediate abolition and John Brown lead a certain type of revolt...these cultural and social acknowledgements must be considered.
Very Well, please! You really wouldn't be giving away any information that could damage your (already soiled,LOL!) reputation by letting me know where you call home!? I know Chumpchimp has attacked the state of New Jersey Knowing that I live here, those being the methods of a child with nothing better to say,! and lacking in imagination! But what he or they fail to realize is that My home is the whole of the United States of America! you see when I joined and served , it was not only for the state I lived, but for the country I loved and love!!!
O.k, 1-War of rebellion (WoR). For we need to address the title for what it really was! and that was a rebellion! We were, and are a country, A country with laws! state and federal. And to Try and do what The CSA did is really nothing less then treason!
Now if any one on this site knows about following or obeying a president I would think its you? Aren't You the one telling me that although you don't agree , or your not a big fan of this loser in the white house he's still the president and until he is removed by impeachment or voted out he's to lead this country otherwise?
Well then, your not giving the same leeway of loyalty for Mr. Lincoln! In thought! Or am I wrong on this and you are in agreement that the act the southern states to attempt to succeed (By a force of arms no less) Was unlawful and treasonous? Try it now, and in retrospect. We're not happy with the way things are going in the capital. And if that man is elected to be president then we are not only not going to not listen to him,we our going to form our own government!
Pretty crazy huh? 2-Mr.Lincolns did care about the slaves,And thought as most people do that it was a barbaric practice and should be Abolished! Tho if it ment keeping the Union together without having this war, he would not have acted on the slavery issue in his time in office! Perhaps never freeing a single slave!
But to Say the Emancipation Proclamation had(NOTHING TO DO WITH THE WAR) Is ludicrous!! And tells me someone is so desperate for argument he will say just about anything!
There are many reasons this act had a lot to do w/ the war , and I will just give you this. When this act went into effect it was pretty much a done deal keeping the British from entering on the side of the south!
Mr.Lincolns duty as president first and foremost was to preserve the Union. And he did! at the cost of his life and nearly 659.000 soldiers, and a few hundred thousand other lives as well. Ole Jefferson Davis seemed to come out unscathed tho! evading capture at the cost of dressing like a women! (fact)! Now I also read that Allen Pinkerton had Mr. Lincoln dress in the same fashion when it was rumored an Assassin was on the prowl somewhere near Baltimore.tho this was never proved it is out there?So what's good for the goose is good for the gander I suppose!
3- John Brown .. funny enough was more like a creationist then not! Tho he tried his hand at many trades, He would usually fail! Before he moved some of his family to Kansas and before Pottawatomie these supporters of brown (really only two) Severed ties always knowing Brown to capable of extreme violence!
Also yes ! as far as the dirt poor farmer w/ no vested interest in slavery not owning slaves and whatnot, I agree w/ you. But, Many were just young and bored and joined only on that basis! Tho once they like anyone else, got a taste of this fight many of those boys said just that! F...k this ! Its a rich mans war and I want no more of it!
In my travels I have had the great pleasure of visiting such places like Franklin Tenn, Getteyburg Pa, Vicksburg Miss, Antietam/Sharpsburg md, New Orleans La, Boonsboro md, Nashville tenn, Chattanooga Tnn, Chickamauga Atlanta,Fredericksburg Va,Manassas Second bull run Va, murfreesboro Ten, Petersburg va, Glorieta pass NM!
And some I may not have mentioned. This may look to be a bit of a bolstering on my part here but hell, I mean this is the topic and I'm trying to make someone aware that making comment like the one I corrected above will not fly! Peace!
tanks, Ranny
I will try and be brief:
1) No, it was an act (or series of acts) of aggression by a President WITHOUT the Constitutional authority to take certain steps. That is inarguable. Secession was a viable option at the time and a number of states had considered it a couple of times in the previous 70-80 years.
(To get a full context of what the States thought o themselves to be, please read the Constitutional Congress of Philadelphia. Read the letters going back and forth between Adams (the father) and Jefferson. Hamilton. Anti-Federalists vs. Federalists. Madison! The USA as we see it today was NOT what they thought then, Randall.)
Secession was not considered treasonous, RF. That is because they saw themselves as a "confederacy". the 10th Amendment seems to say as much. Autonomy was seemingly ok. Lincoln fought to keep a union, in part, because of the belief that a separate and economically independent South was disaster for the North...especially when it came to trade with Europe. (Of course, there were other reasons.)
But, the idea that it was treasonous for States to secede is patently silly.
2) No he did not. You have some contextual reading to do, RF.
No, Mr. Lincoln's first duty was not preserving the union. You can find his duties in the constitution and there is no such preservation clause in there. This is part of the problem...conveniently reading into the Presidency what you would want in there. Same thing going on with those who claim our war in Iraq is llegal. It is in the Constitution and in pretty clear English...THE QUEEN'S ENGLISH, for that matter.
3) Cool.
Young and bored...doubtful. You should read about the recruiting practices in NYC and Ellis Island. (I'm pretty sure they lead to some riots.) Your blanket assertions about "rich man's war" did not really apply to Southerners. Still doesn't.
Thank you for serving, by the way.
A fun book(s) as a solid summary: "Politically Incorrect Guide to the South" and "Politically Incorrect Guide to American History". These are solid and well cited.
Another nutty, religious zealot calling themselves "psalm2516" coming outta the woodwork, and deciding to slander an historical ally, whilst sucking on Saudi Arabia's cock (you know: the fine folks who brought you 9/11, plus other assorted terrorist acts over the last 40 years and killed thousands of Americans). But you still wanna sit there and take potshots at your old neighbour/ally? Fine. Go right ahead. When dumb fucks like yourself reach that point and got nothing except to hurl insults at other nations, it tells me your on the ropes, and got nothin' else. Plus, it seems to me that Canada used its "dog sleds" effectively enough to boot out its own foreign invader a spell back.....care to guess who that was? Yeah....thought so.
It's at least gratifying to see that the U.S. has enough of its own retards, much as we do up here. The biggest difference, of course, is that the U.S. had the misfortune of putting ITS retards in positions of power.
So Stream.....when are you and your buddies gonna go die for Fallujah? And Allah? And when are y'all gonna write to your Republican Congressmen, and ask them to take out the other 35-40 dictators currently operating on the planet? Or ain't those causes "humanitarian" enough for ya? And when is Dick Fuckhead Cheney gonna finally do the world a favour, and take a dirt nap?
well said america was hijacked by an unholy alliance of religious nuts, egomaniacs, elitist neocons and war mongering private enterprise.....i think it's gone for good to quote someone...."i love my country but fear my government"
"Christians leaving Basra despite decades of co-existence
Basra - Voices of Iraq
Sunday , 18 /11 /2007 Time 5:01:37
Basra, Nov 18, (VOI)- "From the tens of thousands of Christian families that used to live in Basra before 2003, only about five hundred remain in the southern city with their eyes on assistance coming from relatives living abroad," Sami Basheer, a Christian from Basra said.
Basra, a predominantly Shiite city in southern Iraq, once a secular city that dealt with people of all religious affiliation with tolerance, has since the U.S.-led invasion of Iraq in March 2003 become a conservative society with Muslim extremists."
(I just love this; and I also LOVE how you and your pals think I use Google and the like; the answer of course, is : Ahhh....no. But keep on guessing. Maybe you'll just come see that I'm just a lot smarter than you....that's all.)
"For the United States, the safest bet would be shipping the material to someplace like New Mexico, but even pro-American Pakistanis would be unlikely to cooperate."
Psalm!... whf are you talking about !?? Now your just being stupid! Are you doing it on purpose!?
The topic was,, (Try to follow) Training the Iraqi ! Its not about our training or our combat readiness! you need to start reading the topic of the conversation before committing yourself the moron! Yea Think?
Where were you stationed? What branch of the service were you in?
Me,,Marine corps 13/12 weeks Parris Island then maybe 1 year in your specified M.O.S...or field! And thats it!!! Any thing else is special training!
And to insult Canada shows just what you really are and what you truly believe in!
Now you're saying we need to train the whole of iraq, for what!, another 8 YEARS !!??? Give it a break! I thank God every morning ,noon,night and in between that you and your people are now a smaller majority then what you used to be! Shows me that some people are waking up and turning away from their third world beliefs.
Please Don't Piss down our backs and tell us its raining!!
Psalm! if your motive for supporting and cheering the sending of my brothers and sisters to die or become maimed for life so you can feel better about whatever it is you need to feel better about yourself is?
Why not take chimmpum and go there yourself ? Like I said if you're so Fraking Gung-ho about killing get your asses over there! And quit supporting the murder my countrymen !!
RF- it comes to this: What would you be willing to die/get maimed/ kill for?
Many of the ones you are currently NOT supporting seem to disagree with you...as if they are not volunteers.
They all chose this, RF. Outside of enlisting to fight, standing armies don't know what or when the fit will hit the shan and therefore, cannot pcik the wars they support.
Stream, what I would fight for? Die for?Willing to be maimed for? Back when I enlisted, I was 17. Then i would have fought anyone at the drop of a hat!
And what's really strange is it was during the Iran hostage crises. We were a bunch of young and Violent kids looking for an outlet for all are pent up hostility.Then BAM!! Iran.
I didn't know how fortunate I was at the time that Jimmy Carter was the commander in chief. And a botched rescue mission was all that was attempted and not an all out war!
For you see it should be decided by the people, people like us When we should or shouldn't go to war!
Of course those kids signed up. Volunteered! But thats not my argument! Its funny that you brought up..(NWoA) cause thats what know this sham to be! Its nothing more then Gwb doing the bidding of the money men!
My argument Is just that! Those boys and Girls fighting for they're country is nothing more then duty! When the war is a just one! (And only a few have been). This war is not one of of them! In a few years these kids are going to have some real issues about why they were there and so on. Like I said before.When we leave, And we will, its going to go...like water finding its own level.
I am very sorry for your lack of understanding about the roles of the branches of the government, RF. The people do not, never have and shouldn't be making decisions about with whom and under what circumstances we go to war. It is certainly not in American tradition or its Constitution.
Stream - The laws as written and the actions taken may be different. With a volunteer military, the people do make the decision on a personal basis, and even with a draft if nobody showed up there would be no war between men.
Stream, I see Sister Symp still can't decide whether she doesn't believe in God, or just hates him. For a guy who hates Christians he sure does go to some length to say how they (we) ought to behave. Hell, if Christians were what he thinks they are, I wouldn't like them either. Then again, i smart people were what he thinks they are, we'd still be sucking bone marrow in cave. And if brave people were what he thinks they are, we'd all be singing Deutschland Uber Alles. The one-word definition for a pacifist who says "fuck" all the time is "coward". Can't wait til Peru attacks. Oh, speaking of Christians and Canada did I tell you about the time I was camping in the North Woods on the Upper Peninsula? I got up to take a leak about four, and there was this black bear messing about in our gear by the canoe. My wife and kid were still asleep so i need to run that sucker off so i got between him and the tent and tried to shoo him. Assuming he was as docile as a Smoky Mountain black, I picked up a stick and marched over and swatted him across the nose. The sumbitch stood up and growled at me. then swatted. Now I was scared. He tried to get me with his paw and I would push and shove and we battled like that all the way to the river, and both of us tumbled in. It was only about 4 feet, go i grabbed him around the neck, and we went under, once, twice, then three times....then all of sudden he stood up and limped away.
You know, the hardest job i ever done was baptizing that bear.
No, it's true. See, a few years later I was mushing dogs up in Algonquin in Ontario, and the Dutchman who ran the dogs told me he heard about a bear up near Churchill holding Wednesday night prayer meetings with other denizens of the forest. 'Course that was kinda hard for me to swallow. But it was an interesting coincidence.
"Oh, Lord, you delivered Daniel from the lion's den, You delivered Jonah from the belly of the whale, Amen! The Hebrew Children from the fiery furnace, oh The Good Book do declare. Well oh, Lord, Lord, if you can't help me For goodness sake don;t you help that bear."
BigotCanuck...you are an embarrassment to peeple who can read. (Not necessarily to those who think, as you don't register there.) Normally, I just let your stupidity exfoliate from the screen like so much exema, but I thought I would read a couple of your Google 101 seminar pages; to wit:
1) Desertion article...you cited it as if you had a point. Brainless: last year, roughly 7 out of a 1000 deserted. This year: 9. No context...no understanding. I know you want us to lose over there, but please, when citing bad news, don't take such glee, coward.
2) How do you know I would not have been in that majority? By 2009? Right now, the way things are trending, it just might happen. Other polls show that, if it is phrased as "surrender" vs. "withdrawal" then those numbers plummet. You really ought to read what ou cite. You, Capt. Craven, are in the minority.
3) I knew it was just a matter of time before you celebrated what Mahmoud was saying. HEY CHUMMIN--I might hve to agree with you on the terror-symp thing. Definitely a back-giving coward.
4) Basra- you have a point? Hey, since what you read on the web is absolutely true (and, clearly it is, because you haven't belched one critical thought in months) what have you found out about the successes in the MiddleEast? I know that no war is perfectly fought or perfectly won, but do you have the courage that you bloviate to see what is going well...what is succeeding?
5) Wait, C...you want to believe Powell now based on his opinion, but not in 2002 when he was citing WMDs in Iraq? Your standards are awfully convenient. Not real smart...just convenient. Heck, he cited his sources in 2002, but not in this article. It all comes back to basic thinking.
6) And now, the piece de resistance: "My pals" want to strike Pakistan? An op-ed piece! One guy a brazen lefty! Canuck...you may want to go back into hiding or simply stick to phallic humor because, dude, you ain't lookin too good.
Canuck, there is no one on your side with the courage to drag out "my bunch" and straighten them out. Just stay at home, Google your daily bread and when reality ever reaches your doorstep, it is because someone here took your advice.
I already asked him that, chuck. He actually gave an honest answer, and said "zilch".
Stream....the difference between what Powell was saying when he was IN the Administration, and what he's saying NOW, in that he's OUT of the Administration, is that he's the ONLY ONE who's fessed up (more or less), and said it was all bullshit, and that HE was fed bullshit. Everyone else CONTINUES to bullshit, or has been fired, or has been otherwise muzzled by King George. And Stream...do you REALLY think that ANYONE in this nutty, fucked-up Administration has ANY idea of what's on in the entire Middle East, because of the shit they've created? Ya think so? Well, YOU tell me:
WE are making an effort to deal with (and take in) average Iraqis who want to flee the festering SHIT that Bush caused.......and yet, the current U.S. Administration has done virtually NOTHING to help these people, in terms if emmigrating to the U.S. to escape that horror.
Know what, Stream? Maybe it truly IS a good thing I don't hold politcial office, y'know? I just wouldn't be cut out for it. Know why? Because the FIRST time I encounter shit like this, or the very first moment I hear the shit that comes out the mouths of you and your nutty, book-burning blowhards.....I'd say, "OKay fine. Clearly you can make do without us and have enough resources to clean up your OWN mess and don't much need us. So buh-bye. Have a nice day. And by the way, since you value your Arab buddies oil so damn much, we'll slowly shutting off our own taps, and nationalizing our resources. See ya."
Soooooo......consider yourself VERY lucky.
(Although if truth be told, I'd probably cave in on that last one, simply because it'd bug me that ordinary, decent Americans who'd never done us any harm or wished us any ill-will, would be negatively impacted. Unless I could find a way to confine it to the deep, deep South......ahhh, never mind.)
Oh, Stream, don't waste time on old arguments. What Canuck's doing here is trying to regurgitate old arguments...he only has 2-3...all of which have been put to bed a long time ago by you. As I said, he's just a sweet, mild pacifist who says fuck a lot. he's older, not like Flag or Fishman100 (do I smell a Fishman200 here?) who throws a tit fit when he can't make everyone bow to his point. (It heps, if pointing an accusing finger, you aren't holding your dick in your ear with the other. people tend not to take that kind of person seriously.) Sister Symp is different. She want to think she'll finally run into someone out there who's just watching, who buy into his bag of shit and think he's cool. He has real serious self-confidence issues. Not to mention paranoia. In any case, it's his type to re-run old arguments ad inifinitum, as if there were brand new ears and eyes out ther on a new slate. That's sort of what i like about him...like old Fritz Mondale, coming out of hiding every few weeks just for one more good old ass kicking.
Stream, when Powell "presented" the "evidence" to the UN in 2002 it was so obviously fake that he lost all my respect and that of most Europeans. For some wiered reason many people in the USA still think it was evidence.
But you did prove before how much you embrace strawmen, no matter how laughable they are.
You've been misinformed, Microbe. The Euros provided much of the intel for Powell's declarations, along with CIA and State. Since what you (we) know now and what you 9we) will know in say 2o years will most likely change. It will be easier for me to re-evaluate what I think now for I have never locked myself in when knowledge in the area is admittedly superficial. You on the other hand will live or die by your words since your vanity will never let you openly say "oops", and re-evaluate. That's why we call you guys useful idiots. When you do finally wake up and see the facts, usually around 30, you can't admit it. In the end, your puppet-masters have bought your silence.Some of the best and brighest from England in the 30s-40s were silenced that way, the same for America's brightes in the 60s....all because of an obsessive vanity and self-love. Bingo
you terror symps just need to listen to me when i tell you you can stop with all the struggling. one way or another im gonna put your huge dicks in my ever so huge anus! thats what all terror symps are gonna get! you better watch out! i am chummlnn hear me roar!
You did not really see the presentation Powell did? The stuff he presented looked like Homer Simpson trying to fake stuff, it was totally laughable, fuzzy pictures of some building structure and the comment that this shows structures they believe to be large tanks probably full of nerve gas, or maybe components for it, or maybe not.
A.R.S.E soul and Stream'o'bullshit unfortunately for you both, TheBug is completely right in his assessment of the Powell speech.
You both know this hence you begin to hurl insults. Time honoured tactics for you both I see
Whilst Powell did a good job of trying to appear convincing (his ass was on the line remember), the substance of what he presented was so obviously false, and has been proven as such in subsequent years, that watching you try and justify this invasion based on that intel is rather like watching the ice sheets melt faster than at any time in recorded history. Horrifying.
Think there was also a famous 'Dossier' of intel which Tony Blair had at his disposal. This included work directly lifted from academic journals several years old.
Up to the minute intel there... I guess there's something in the bible that tells you this intel was correct right?
THE WAR IS ILLEGAL
THE WAR WAS STARTED UNDER FALSE PRETENCES
THE WAR IS ESSENTIALLY ABOUT SECURING STRATEGIC OIL RESERVES
Deal with it. No need to keep fighting these facts. Simply suck it up and go forward.
Flagg, That's why you're who you are, and I'm who I am. I amaze a lot of people. Sorry, it's one of the sadnesses of your generation, but you don't amaze me. I've shown you the way out. Use the ladder, or stay withe shovel. Best of luck
Canuck...follow that story closely. It seems to have exploded all over the airwaves because it exposed so much...news...wait, what was it about again?
Google it again, C. Maybe there's a stroy there.
Mako...have you found anyone who will prosecute? Anyone who has the same reading of the Constitution as you?
I know someone...a champion of the people. A true originalist. A man among men...
Look, on the horizon, being beamed in via UFO...Dennis Kucinich! He'll prosecute!
"Stand back, vile capitalists! I will thwart the evil cabal that is the GWB Administration. On Murtha, On Leahy, On Pelosi and Clinton. HIYA!"
I see.
God Bless him and his family for the ultimate sacrifice.
According to you, he is the badguy, right? You are a callous, cold-hearted white feathered lilly to post a story like that to celebrate bad news in order to bolster your cowardly position.
When faced with a moral problem, always do what Canuck does:
Didn't like being made to look like a goddamn stupid fool who's cracking jokes about your dumb fuck of a President, while young men like this lose their lives, did you?
It's tough to be the flag-waving, bloodhungry zealot, when an actual face is STARING at you, as you make feeble jokes.....isn't it?
Trust me, sport....I'll be more than happy to rub your Saudi ass-kissing face into each and every time.
(Nice feeble try at trying to twist my words, though; VERY feeble)
(your quote) "Stand back, vile capitalists! I will thwart the evil cabal that is the GWB Administration. On Murtha, On Leahy, On Pelosi and Clinton. HIYA!"
You post a potshot at some decent people who are critical of this OCCUPATION, and its rational....while at the same time portraying G. DUBYA Fuckhead as a victim. You make stupid jokes like this....yet you cry foul when you have to look at the face of an innocent young kid, who died because....well....I don't know why. Only that he was sent there, on the orders of a complete imbecile.
So, the point was not to use this tragic story to futher any arguemnt I (or anyone else) might have...rather, to prove the point that you're so quick to throw 30,000 more kids like this into a "surge" and joke about the guy who sent them there....than to have to actually look into the kids face. Puts a different spin on it...don't it, tough guy?
Besides, why the outrage? Your Saudi/Pakistani/Egyptian buddies have been ruthlessly killing young men like this lad for years and years now.
You defend THEM by saying nothing in the way of condemning their actions, but suddenly you lament this kid.
A little late (not to mention hypocritical) don't you think?
Those who pledge their life to protect their country do have the fucking RIGHT that their government will send them into a fight only if there is absolutely no other option. The GWB government is definitely guilty of having started a totally unnecessary war which cost many lifes.
Ummmm...noooooo.....I was comparing this article and its tragic topic, with YOUR little "joke" that portrayed the fuckin' idiot who sent him there in the first place as the sympathetic character, or victim, in your little "joke" (this is kinda confirmed in the way you describe the other characters in your "joke" as "traitors" and "liars"....although I would hasten to add that THEY sound more like loyal, American patriots than YOU do in a lifetime).
Hey Stream! Why don't you and the Canuck-bashing Carlysle Group, as well as your psalm buddy check this out, and discover the the fantastic new way in which this Administration is fucking up relations between our two nations:
Damn, I wish hey were even worse. I'm for bringin back the ambassador and closing the border until they get rid of the Terror-Symps in Ottowa and Toronto.
Stream! Seriously! All bullshit aside! Look! Someone actually wrote an op-ed piece about you and and your Carlysle Group! Hell, he even came up with a LABEL for your type!:
Gettin hit with big cast iron frying pan has made you even more stupid.
I am thoroughly enjoying watching you and theGnat make fools of yourself. Buggery--in aligning yourself with those who voluntarily check their minds and spines at the door, you show a lighter shade of thought that was only evident before in what you denied.
I am not going to re-hash the same arguments that flattened you in the first place. I know Canuck has no opinion beyond what he is told (see virtually everything ever cited him). I also know that he is deeply and probably neurotically desirous of others approval (read his "please, oh please like me" piece about the local theatre group.) Further, Canuck is a known bigot and liar...the last two have been proven. Canuck's use is only entertainment.
Oh, and internet citations...mustn't forget.
Buggery--if Powell's 2002 presentation was such obvious garbage and so transparent, where was the outcry? Why didn't anyone cry BS? (Your leadership is singing a slightly different tune these days...like in France. Hmmm, could it be that giving your backs to terrorists isn't a successful strategy? Could it be that some people see winning a war like this as (GASP) a moral imperative?)
Lookk out Canuck...Canada's next!
So, Chummin...You suggest NOT going through Canucklehead's articles and dismembering them because I already did his previous? I know, Canuck will prance around here, piss proud and gloating...but, I am ok with that. We rednecks have a few things in common: Believe in Jesus, big and strong, defend the weaker, constantly kill gnats and love our country.
The only thing a few of these clinchpoops have in common is the color yellow.
Nah, just remember the true audience are the silent ones watching/reading, not these simpletons. I confess it is fun, thoug, don't you? If you have the time, go for it...it is good practice for when you run into better minds or real men, as you no doubt will (though not on Glumbert).
Just remember that every time they respond with that sort of quackery (Sister Symp seems obssessed with impressing some unseen little chippie out there with his ability to cut and paste web addresses)...
our side wins, no matter what they say or what the debate is about.
And everytime they run and hide from an argument or a question...(again Sister Symp seems to have running away in his blood...he has to be French, I just feel it in my bones)...
We win.
When they figure that out they will know why we are here, and they will figure out the name of the game.
Right now, all they are is caught...between two handlers...the kill-and-hate mongers... and us. Ever watch a frog dance in frying pan?
Remember all of you are TERROR SYMPS and when GWB really gets the machine going he will be bringing our Saddam's torture methods to you all. GWB isn't building all of those internment camps in the US for us!.
shitline, you are good at calling names. Unfortunately thinking is not exactly your thing. History also is a bit short on your end.
The stunts your government has pulled to start the war are not exactly new, unfortunately it is also not new that there will be a sufficient number of idiots who buy the bullshit.
The interesting thing is that most of the bullshit by now has been acknowledged as such by your very own government (though they called it bad intelligence - pun intended), but still you believe in it????
Books are for reading, not for heating. Just a little free of charge hint to help you out of your ignorance.
Doing some travelling to places where you meet people with different cultural background also helps a lot. The rest of the world is not yearning to play swinette in their free time.
What a picture of A.R.S.E soul and Stream'o'Bullshit engaged in a lovely duet...
Streamy was not a Communist, he was a canoeist.
He was not a balloonist, he was a feuilletonist.
He was not a vernacular writer, he was a funicular writer.
He stood on the slag heap of the old St. Joe paper mill like a rooster on a dung hill and sounded his barbaric yawp. The Swinette-Picker of American Letters.
Spake Streamy, 'I dream of playing the swinette on stage, at Americana music festivals, selling my books at the record table afterwards. A swinette, you stretch two horsehairs across a hog's ass and pick it with your teeth.'
Chummin mounts the steps, walks across the stage with great dignity, takes a stuffed Miss Piggy doll out from under his robes, lifts her skirt, presses her butt to his face, and squeals like a stuck pig.
Great cry and little wool, as the Devil said when he sheared the hogs.
I always knew the day would come when I came across something akin to a nuclear bomb to drop on Streamlined and his Carlysle Group, as well as all other religious and so-called "patriotic" zealots; and now I've found it. I challenge HIM, as well as his nutty group to sit through ALL of what I'm about to post here, then we'll see what's what. It's not often I view something that disturbs me ( I mean DISTURBS....not ANGERS). This truly was bothersome. It basically rips to shreds every single fibre of ALL religious, economic and political beliefs (Stream? Ya might as well well jump off a bridge right now, and take your little playmates with you) across all bandwidths. And the conclusion will probably give any SANE person nightmares. Here you go:
Canuck...I will probably watch it. However...seriously, do you NOT have the capacity to post an original thought. You are influenced so deeply by the media; that scares me. People who watch the news and uncritically filter it...people who can't stand the thought of another side of the story...simpletons who willingly ignore the obvious to keep their beliefs, well, simple. I mean, you posted links to stories that (hypothetically) support your beliefs. Then, in a mtter of a couple of sentences from moi, your theses is destroyed. But, from you...MORE POSTS...and one a movie. You are a miracle.
Wait, no such things...forgot.
Congrats to you and Buggered for teaming up and through your combined efforts of denial and willing ignorance have dumbed this place down.
> simpletons who willingly ignore the obvious to keep their beliefs
Ah, you are talking about yourself.
I don't see how you can argue away the facts that Iraq had no weapons of mass destruction, was not involved in terror activities in any significant way, was invaded by the USA on false assumptions, and that the USA are just ignoring the very values they supposedly want to spread in the world with Guantanamo, Abu Greibh and all the facist measures implemented with the Patriot Act.
Iraq HAD WMDs...remember, they used them. Your selective memory is as bad is Canuck. That is also why the UN was inspecting them, gettng run out of there and constantly returning conflicting reports. To what extent they buried, destroyed or sold what was left over is anyone's guess.
Second, they harbored and trained terrorists. (I notice you qualified your query. Good move.)
Third, indicting an entire policy that you conveniently disagree with due to the actions of a few at the Abu Ghraib hazing incident shows you to be, sigh, small. (Our boys at Gitmo are doing the right thing! Keep it up guys!)
Just like Canuck, when reality winds up at your doorstep it will be because some agreed with you. Until then, we will keep the heat on and (mark my words here) more will rejoin the fight as it gets results. So far, from what i get from the likes of you is that you were fine with Iraq developing WMDs, killing and torturing its citizenry and funding terrorism around the world.
Just as long as it doesn't come to your house, right Bug?
"you were fine with Iraq developing WMDs, killing and torturing its citizenry and funding terrorism around the world."
Stream.....are you STILL on that rant?? If you were that concerned about "terrorism" around the world, then you should really be directing your anger at your Saudi friends; you know....the folks who have been the prime exporters/breeding ground for "terrorists" for oh, about the last 40 years or so (with Egypt thrown in to boot). Whatsamatter? Can't find them? Dick Cheney won't give you a map? Okay...well...go east a few thousand miles, and turn right at the third desert desert you come to; then go south. It'll be the theocratic dictatorship on your left, that still treats women like dogs; has public executions; "religious police"; NO democratic elections; Islamic extremists who've been responsible for more American deaths over the years, than Saddam in his whole tenure; and OH! Lots and lots of money that was used to buy the collective asses of Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld and Bush Sr., thus kind of making them high-paid whores who've betrayed their Republic.
Stream, I should maybe not expect too much of you, there are a lot of things that are too complex to understand for a swinette playing gym sweeper from the south who botched his zoology study.
I will try to make it as simple as possible for you, since you seem to be quite confused about the facts and their time line.
Iraq developing and using WMD: Historically correct, they used them in the Iran/Iraq war (during which they were sponsored with money and military material by the US) partially against their own population. They did not use them in the second gulf war in 1991 (the gulf war syndrome was tracked to the depleted uranium ammunition used by US troops, though the Pentagon still denies this). After the second war the UN sanctions and inspections resulted in a complete destruction of these weapons and the carrier missiles. There were no WMD in the Iraq when Bush used them as a reason for his war and this was a fact known to the UN.
Harboring terrorists: There were no training camps in Iraq as Bush did state. Interestingly Usama Bin Laden was funded and trained by the USA when he fought against the Russians in Afghanistan. Is the USA going to invade itself? I wonder how long national guard and coast guard could stand against navy and marines.
Killing and torturing: At least this one is true and there is no excuse for this. Though the invasion did also kill a lot of civillians and the insurgency keeps to kill people and will for many years to come. So when will the USA dethrone the remaining dictators around the world? There are a lot of smaller countries that don't even have a proper army and no oil wells to blow up.
Guantanamo: People are held prisoner without a fair trial or any resemblence of a proper legal procedure that is due for a country that calls itself a democracy. The US constitution (and the constitution of any free democratic country) gives everyone the right to have a fair trial regardless of what they are accused of, where they come from and who they are. I am not saying that everyone held prisoner in Guantanamo is not guilty, but without a fair trial it is impossible to find out who is and who is not. What is done in Guantanamo is not even a little bit better than what Saddam did in his torture chambers, the USA should be ashamed of this.
Abu Ghuraib: Funny how a whole prison staff can do such things for months without any consequences and when it hits the fan only the small shits get some moderate punishment.
Uhm, you know Saddam, you did something the family did not like. -cough- Not like at all. -cough- You have been like a son to us. -cough- But this made us very unhappy...
Same story over and over again. Once a US supported dictator steps over the line and becomes uncontrollable he is declared evil. The means of getting rid of him can differ, the basic principle is always the same: As long as he does what the USA want he can kill and maim as many of his people as he likes.
Does not matter any more, he has been turned into a footnote of history. Another dictator and country who got used and thrown away (to country not yet of course, there is a lot of oil left and a lot of money to make).
How was that thing about bringing freedom and democracy? When Kuwait was liberated from Iraq the old repressive regime was put into power again. Would have been a good opportunity to help these people to establish a democracy, but I guess the oil contracts were still honored by the exile regime.
Canuck and Bug Braintrust:
1. Enjoy a lttle context. It is not unusual for a political friend of one era to not be one in another. Again, since you two willingly give up your humanly cognitions, I will be your surrogate.
http://archive.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2003/4/9/91851.shtml
2. C-Why bring up the SA argument again? Because we are on a new thread? Must be...I slapped up upside the head with the Logical Skillet on one of our first go-rounds. Who cares whether you agree or not...being unable to think continues to be your expertise.
3. Bug--Stupid is on parade tonight. Really, no WMDs in Iraq when we used that as one of the reasons for going in? Well, according to some of the Iraqi's who were working on them, you are wrong. Again, many of the chemical antecedents have been found...maybe not the warehouses full, but evidence still exists. (Please see Stephen F. Hayes.) (Oh gosh, dissenting opinion from the elitists. How dare I?) Further, UN sanctions resulted in WHAT?! Keep smokin' the smart weed, buddy. I guess that would explain all the later sanctions that Saddam obeyed as well. You just keep getting smarter and smarter.
Yes, there were training camps. Old news. (Also, those weren't the only reasons Saddam was dangerous. Do you not remember what he said about the west and democracy and what he wished to do?! If I told you, with my hand in my jacket, that I had a gun and that I might attack, would you not retaliate? (We know Canuck wouldn't) What if later you found the gun I was purporting to have was not real at the time, but I had used one in the past? Starting to get it, genius?)
No, it is urban legend that we funded Bin laden. (Your IQ is rising even as you read this.)
The dethroning might occur should it impact our national interest. Glad you admit that much. By the way, when have you all stood up to fight for the little guy? I know you have, I just can't remember when you acted in a "community" sort of way.
Gitmo-No, our Constitution does not say that. FYI- Prisoners of war are not accused of crimes for which they get legal counsel. Duh. The argument from those on your side is to get them accused of something, and then they can get legal representation. (BTW...you had better check on their representation. Many are getting it and gettin it free by US lawyers. Because their communiques are held as private, many of these "detainees" are getting messages out to their jihadi brothers. You feeling smart yet?)
I was always wondering where the people are that believe the gravity defying crackpot arguments used by the US government.
You are really good: The argument with the WMD is true because it was used to invade Iraq by the band of criminals that run the US government?
Great, you did that before in your creationism stupidity, self referencing.
BTW: Nice sources, do you have any credible ones?
Bashing France was going high in the USA when the war was whipped up, you should still be ashamed of that: Some of your major European allies told you that it is not right to invade Iraq and that it will not go well. Now it is not going well and all you know is building another set of legends to prove it is going well even if it isn't.
Components for WMD: I know you are one of the guys who think science is witchcraft and don't understand shit about physics or chemistry, but every household has a couple substances, that can be used to make explosives and toxins. Industry has even more of those and a broader selection. Blow up a chemical plant and you will get a nice cloud of toxins.
This is just the same as the stupid security measures they do at the airports, liquid binary explosives, my ass. Someone did watch too much James Bond or McGyver.
Guantanamo: No excuses there, you want to decide who deserves rights and who does not, you are not any better than Saddam. How would you like it if someone prepared evidence to prove you are a Taliban?
You gave three links: two of them are to right-wing mouthpieces, and the other is a radical, reformed right-wing feminist who has a picture of herself holding a gun and advertises Fox News on her website.
Niiiiiiice.
They all browbeat France as being sympathetic to Saddam, yet STILL no mention from them (or YOU) about Rummy shaking hands with the bastard, like they're poker buddies.
Stream...c'mon. Don't you get tired of being a punching bag?
Thanks, Bug...please educate me more. You, who are so wise in the ways of science.
France-bashing?! That's all that you got?! My, my...you are illiterate. And, proud. Mustn't forget that. So proud, that you think facts are such due to consensus. (Big Bang anyone?)
I suggest more reading. Read what Saddam's own scientists said. Read what types of chemicals have been found AND in what form. Read what European data suggested.
You are now in the official realm of denier. (I know you wouldn't deny the Holocaust. But, leaving out context, leaving out facts, leaving out what was said at the time creates fertile ground for something awful again. Heck, what the Iraqi's went through is certainly comparable in its nature. Remember the mass graves...or, did that not happen either?)
Canuck, if you are reading along...that is part of the humanitarian argument.
Canuck...downloading gay porn so often has caused you to see sexuality where there isn't.
When was that video shot again?
I hae already explained context to you and I can only assume you reject it.
On second thought, maybe you should stick with what you know...
Streamlined, that a right wing asshole like you starts using the holocaust as a comparison for Saddam does not really astonish me, but it shows even more how twisted your recognition of facts and history is. You don't know shit what you are talking about. Saddam was an evil person, but you have no idea what you are talking about, this is simply out of proportion.
But since you brought up the 3rd Reich: I recommend to you to do some reading about how it came to that, how the manipulation by people like Göring did work, how the propaganda worked against the Jews, how the populace was made to comply with the crackpot ideas . These concepts have not been abandoned with the end of WWII and they still work.
Regarding chemicals: I did read the news about that. There were amazing things like a defunct mobile lab that had not been used in years and a couple barrels with various substances that could be used to make pesticides or nerve gas (chemically some of those are very close relatives). They also found a lot of scrapped Scud missiles and some components. And there was a short range missile that did go a bit further than UN sanctions did permit.
Impressive arsenal all in all.
Saddam was at least half mad and did try to trick the USA out of invading the Iraq, so he played up the military power he had available. Unfortunately people like our dear shitline can not distinguish between rant and fact.
Canuck...noticed you didn't answer the question. So, deception is not beyond you. Keep it up.
Li'l Buggy...The ONLY reason Saddam's regime did not rise to the level of Hitler was the intervention and threat thereof by outsiders. Hitler's rise paralleled a morally relativistic press and leadership in the US. Right now, if it smells of world-hungry power grabbing, we are going to get involved...so as not to have another Hitler. Feel free to join in.
That is a heckuvan admission, B. My analogy still stands. AND, it shows the intelligence was not false or fabricated...even the Euro intelligence. It can now be said definitively that Saddam had designs on WMDs.
Keep changing your argument, Bug. First you say, "NO WMDs. GWB made it all up." Now you say, "OK, Yes he eas trying to make WMDs but his capacity was exaggerated." You and Canuck will get your lies straight one day.
If he was such a "Hitler" during his while reign, and had to be stopped.....then why was your then-Administration cozying up to him? Selling him arms? Selling him intelligence against HIS neighbours? Maybe you better learn to keep your White House employees in check, in terms of propping up dictators, and then laughably trying to take the moral high-ground by claiming "Ohhhhh!!! He's baaaaaad!". You know, kind of like what one of your previous Administrations did with Noriega (former CIA employee-dictator bites his handlers on the ass....that kind of thing).
I am not changing any arguments. All that was found in Iraq was left over scrap from the nerve gas production they did during the first gulf war. No production line, no stockpile of nerve gas or precursors. UN inspections have been successful though not easy.
streamlined, stop making such stupid comparisons, you are demeaning millions of people who died in concentration camps and in the second world war. It is bad enough that you are incapable of learning from histor¥, but it is inexcusable that you make such comparisons totally out of proportion and context.
streemy talks about conspiracy. well, there is one. it's called dominioinism... it threatens the very fabric of our society. everything from public education to foreign policy will be run according to biblical principal. some members include supreme court justices scalia and thomas..see www.theocracywatch.org
buggy your right its borg singular .....i got a question. howcome evryone on talk radio in america have the same views on all subjects.....(statistically speaking) from dr laura to rush limbaugh they are monolithic.
Ahhhh, Stream. I love it when you're on the ropes, and you have to sink to such banalities (i.e. personal insults as a retort). LOVE IT. Just remember who's initials were on the hammer that wrecked all of your nutty delusions (mine). In closing, chew on this:
1. It isn't a "movie"; it's a "documentary" with names, places, dates and facts (most of which I've been drilling into YOUR head for months and months now; so finally a case of a source providing credence to what I'VE been saying, as opposed to your nonsensical accusations of it being the other way around....)
2. You have NO wriggle room to dispute this material, else you would have made even a FEEBLE attempt to do so. You have not. At all.
3. And lastly.....(you know what's coming....dontcha?)..........
Checkmate.
P.S. to Chuck:
Nahhh. Are you kidding me? I had my venting with him and his Carlysle Group-Westboro Baptist-Wannabes a long time ago. Since then, my sole objective is just to gut them whenever possible, and show them up for the ignorant buffoons they parlay themselves to be (of course, they kind of help matters, being from the deep, deep South).
This DOCUMENTARY is just another salvo at them.....a BIG one.
If one keeps it in that context, then it's actually kind of entertaining.
Canuck- I loooooooove it when you say "Checkmate". Thus far, each time you use it, I show that you either don't know what it means (possible) or don't know how to apply it (most likely.)
Why haven't you Googled it yet? Your skilled use of the internet will garner you many sites dedicated to definitions. (Gullible is not in the dictionary...seriously, go look it up.)
I've been following with great interest the debate on Glumbert on the United States' involvement in Iraq and the general principles of the "War on Terror".
Whatever else one may say, those taking part seem exceptionally well briefed and make their points well. The debate is both healthy and timeless. Every time a government leads its people into a foreign conflict, the populace is split. (Suez, Korea, Vietnam...the list is endless)
I well remember my parents holding diametrically opposed views on Eden's decision to invade Egypt during the 1956 Suez crisis. My father was all for it, while my mother (who seldom became excited over politics) was vehemently opposed to British military action.
Although I was very young at the time, I have vivid memories of the heated discussions that took place in our house, and although I didn't understand what was going on, this was my first exposure to the effect that international affairs can have on the home front.
The wireless (radio to the younger generation) became the focal point, and my parents would sit glued to the set, poring over every announcement, always ready to make new points on the perceived rights or wrongs of the government's position.
Sometimes the arguments became quite heated - quite worrying for a small lad.
I recall vividly coming home from school to find my mother lying in a pool of blood on the kitchen floor with an axe sticking out of her head, and my father being taken away to begin his life sentence.
Aposite given your old handle but I have brass clock taken from a German U-boat. My grandfather was in the Royal Navy in WWII running escort on the Arctic convoys and picked it up somewhere in Norway apparently
It's a beautiful clock, brass, works perfectly, still has the original key to open the face and wind it. It's the tiny swastika and serial number inlaid into the ceramic face which make it a somewhat eerie thing to possess.
No awful effects other than he never, ever spoke a word about it. Ever.
Interesting. A serious reply here.
My uncle was captain of a Corvette on the Russian convoys. He didn't speak much about it either. But yes, it was undoubtedly pretty dire up around Murmansk with the waves turning to ice on the foredeck and rigging.
No counselling for these guys either, eh?
They don't make them like that any more.
What's goin' on? Don't they all believe in the "humanitarianism" of it all? I guess Georgie-Boy is pretty well frsh out of friends now (Howard, Blair....POOF! Gone)
You and your band of Crackpot Realists better write to these people, Stream.......and SET THEM STRAIGHT about this being all part of a "humanitarian mission".
After all, we can't let those annoying figures get the way....now can we?
I liked the following statement: While it would be wrong to blame anyone for their lack of education, this disregard for scientific methods and results is inexcusable. As one observer succinctly put it: if you don't believe in random sampling, the next time your doctor orders a blood test, tell him that he needs to take all of it.
The criticism of the methods is well in line with streamlined's typical reasoning (if we want to take the liberty to call it such).
Now you see the nerve of those Pakistanis? Those poor folks are all mad at Bush's pal, Musharrif, and why? All because he suspended their Constitution, invoked martial law, rounded up his most vocal critics, arrested a bunch of lawyers, and basically is proving to be a nice, little dictator:
Hey Stream! Ordinary Pakistanis are even calling him "Bushariff"....LMFAO!
Question: Do you honestly think there may be SOMEBODY over at the White House secretly creaming their pants over this, and silently whispering to themselves "FUCK! I wish WE had the balls to do THAT! Beautiful!"
Ahhhh well. One dictator who became useless...and another dictator supported and cultivated.
Bush Foreign Policy continues...........................
That policy of the USA is much older than the Bush government.
Where is the US support for democracy and freedom now? Pakistan definitely is a country that is much closer to being able to be a stable democracy than many other countries, they need and deserve support.
BUT........I want to make clear (as I always do), that my comments are confined to successive U.S. governments/administrations.....NOT at the average working Joe (who lives north of the Mason-Dixon Line....LOL!)
Stream! When ya think George is gonna stop his little game, and let these poor folks go home? Huh? Don't ya think they've had enough already? C'mon, Mr. "Practicing Christian".....why don't ya write to George and tell him to do that.....okay?
What happened to Free Speech, Stream, huh? What gives? Why these poor kids bein' accosted by your patriotic kinfolk with the Confederate Flags? Huh? And all dey be doin', is sayin' "Peace, Bro". Ya think that's "un-American"? "Anti-Bush"? "Anti-Cheney"? "Unpatriotic"? Hmmm... I seem to recall a great American statesman once saying that dissent is the conerstone of our liberty and freedom".
But THIS? Why shucks....this almost sounds like.....fascism. FANATICAL fascism.
Kinda what you found in folks in a certain country in Europe in, oh, around 1933 or so.
Canuck and Bug...you two are priceless.
Canuck, you continue to swallow whole anything on the web. You are an idiot of biblical proportions. How many more will have to incinerate to show you to be one of Canada's dullest: The Peace Shirts...really. I am sure it happened just like that. There is no other side to the story or no details being left out to keep the story inside the framework. (C-they are writing for people like you...who gulp it down.)
The Pakistan story...is this news? Moron. This was in the same story, brainiac. "While many Pakistanis lament that the Bush administration is involved in their country's politics, they also see the United States as the only force strong enough to do what they say is necessary to temper the crisis: pressure the military-led government to restore the constitution, release thousands of political prisoners and lift restrictions on the news media." Not as black and white as you would wish.
Refugees...maybe they don't want to return yet. Maybe it is not time yet, even if they want to. Do you have a point beyond showing yourself to be a one-sided record.
Brain damage...other than being Canadian, what constitutes brain damage? (Here's the safety net from the story,"Most of the new cases involve mild or moderate brain injuries, commonly from exposure to blasts." Key on the words "Most", "new", "mild", "moderately", and "commonly", illiterate one.)
You seem to have an unending flow of articles. What do you think, Canuck? We have been down this road and you are outclassed...as is theBuggered.
Diyala--Did you mean to post an article that cites the overall surge success? (I know that is bad news to you, but really!) Key sentence, "The redeployment without replacement reflects overall improved security within Iraq," military spokesman Rear Admiral Gregory Smith told a news conference.
No context, no nuance, no history. To you, it is just imperial USA getting in where it doesn't belong and it is that simple. You have no idea what your leaders would have done given the same circumstances...but, you can rest assured that our attitude would have been, "GO GET THE BAD GUYS." In yours, Mako's and Buggered's small little computerized world, there aren't any bad guys. Heck, we're all just different. Odd, since you seem to be so morally outraged...when you have none to outrage.
Keep posting, cutie. You are my favorite target practice.
Target practice, good idea, you need a lot of that as you miss every point with very high margin.
canuck is doing what you fail totally: Getting information from various sources. Your typical wannabeechristianbutbeingfacistintruth sources do hardly qualify as information, much less as reliable.
If anyone here is without context and history it is you. Being born in the backwater of a country that has only a few 100 years of history, failed to learn anything about the world, and now actively denying any information from outside that contradicts your crackpot view of the world.
Go learn something about the world, get a perspective that not everything is like Heckensack, see that people in the rest of the world may have a totally different idea about life and that this does NOT mean they are wrong. Or enlist in the army and do your best to find some landmine in Iraq or anywhere.
Buggered- your euro-jealosy is showing. If I had a hanky for what ails you, I would give it.
I have often suspected, given the history of Western Europe through kingships, various monarchies, dictators and such, that it is anathema in much of your cultural thought for a country like ours, founded in part by red-neck agricultural-types to rise to this stature. I know what political philosophies influenced and even governed your country. Human beings, according to people like you, need shepherds and stewards, because the average guy can't effectively think and do for himself...right? (Interesting clash of ideals is occurring right now in Europe: Many of the elites who believe what I just wrote are also arguing for an anti-religious freedom that removes strictures and controls from people. Iguess it is jst a matter of who's in control. The elitism and snobbery isn't gone...just transferred to a new king: The experts. So willing to turn over the reins of your life to something you want to associate with. It is human nature, that urge...being a part of something, being a member of a group, feeling included...it can lead to sycophancy and it can lead to sacrificing oneself for the approval of others (right, Mako, Canuck?) OR...it can lead to a humble submission to the Highest Power.)
If you don't accept a Hgher Power, then from whom do you seek approval?
By the way, how's your last few 100 years? You must be very proud.
Ummmm......if you really wanted to go after the "bad guys", then how come you never went after Saudi Arabia? Or Pakistan? Or Kuwait? Or took Libya off the "terror list"? Or Syria? Or Jordan? Or Yemen? Huh? I mean....these folks were ( and ARE) dictatorships, who've been VERY bad for a long, long time.
Free pass for all of the Americans they've killed?
lmfao 5 points to the amercians thyey dnt give a rats a ss they dnt wnt the iraqies to be in tip top shape its ameriaca the gotta be #1 and if they train thm to good there gunna hve a tuff time next time they raid and rob there oil.
Usually, in all of my shots at you, your retorts always consisted of two elements:
1. A lot of Crackpot Realist mumbo-jumbo, cradled in a Republican-fed, right-wing, religious-based extremist viewpoints;
2. Blanket insults at anothers nationality (in the "christian way", of course).
But this time...you've actually added something new: all you've done is look at everything I've posted, ram your fingers in your ears, and say "It's stupid! It's stupid! I'm not listening! BLAH-BLAH-BLAH!! I'M NOT LISTENING!"
And ay know what? That's okay too, my Redneck, bigoted, evangelical, insular little hillbilly friend. Because we all know that this is all you have. Whenever the media (print, internet or TV) report even the smallest of items that might give Bush or his policies a SMIDGEON of favourability....then you'll quote them without the slightest problem. Then they DO have a use. But when the vast MAJORITY of it is negative...then you put the blinders on, and castigate them. Pathetic. I, on the other hand, will happily boil it all down for you, to make it more easily palpable for you, to get it into your belly. I do this as a community service (no thanks needed):
1. Fact: Pakistan is being run by a dictator, who has suspended their constitution; stifled dissent, etc. and he is supported by YOUR President, Mr. G. Dubya Fuckhead. FACT.
2. Fact: Yes, the "surge" has improved security somewhat (G.I. deaths are down....but Iraqi deaths continue to soar), but what now? You gonna keep those extra 30,000 troops there forever? If you have a crime-infested neighbourhood, and you inject a gazillion cops into it, sure the crime will decrease....BUT IT'S A BAND-AID SOLUTION! Gawd, you're out of it. If it were left all up to you, those young American troops there won't be coming home until they're about to take retirement!
3. Fact: You are currently following a religious belief that is based upon the beliefs of ancient Egyptians, pre-dating "christianity" by about 1500 years, with all of the trimmings (dead three days; a crucifixion; ressurrection; yadda-yadda-yadda), and you sit here a lecture Mr. Bug and everyone else about "thinking for themselves"??? Like, do you walk around your own neighbourhood with a sandwhich sign, that says "I am a joke"? Gimme a break already.
4. Fact: Iraqi refugees can't return homes because of a FUCKIN' OCCUPATION AND A CIVIL WAR IN THEIR COUNTRY!!! Like holy shit, Batman...where the fuck HAVE YOU BEEN?? Unreal, you are.
5. Fact: YOU (and your band of Crackpot Realists) are terrorist sympathizers. And what is the basis of my saying this? Simple: You continually support, or are otherwise sympathetic to, theocratic dictatorships, who breed and export radical elements who kill Americans. Example? Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, Kuwait, Libya, ad nauseum. Lots of insults and potshots outta you about Canada and Canadians (as well as other more civilized people than you) .....but not a SINGLE disparaging word about any of THEM. Why izzat? Simple: You're a terror-symp. And you like them. And because George and George Sr. and Dick likes them. I think you should be shipped to Gitmo, and waterboarded. Anyone who supports the deaths of his fellow countrymen by radical elements, SHOULD be dealt with. Swiftly. You symp.
6. Fact: Your pal Rummy and Saddam were bosom buddies; go look at the video again. Rummy was there to sell him arms and intelligence against Iran. See how warmly they shake hands? Gives me a cavity just looking at it. I guess that would make Rummy a terror-symp as well....wouldn't it?
In closing Stream...please keep it up. I have enjoyed gutting you open this day.
You know, you'd think Her ladyship would actually be able to state one FACT among all those "facts". You know the definition of stupidity as we can no longer mark this up to being misinformed. I do like it though when that ball-less bitch hits High C, though. My glasses broke as I read it. Cheers
Good morning, Buggered...thank you for your response that is well in line with your intellect. (Oh no, I am making my country look bad. I guess you are now concerned with how we look to the world, too. Puts you right up there with such great back-givers as Canuck and Mako.) Oh, and you have friends in the USA. Well, how magnanimous of you. I have friends in Germany as well...You certainly do not represent their thinking. (and I use the term loosely.) Now I will go and shut up.
Great retorts, Mako. Has the swelling subsided?
And, Canucklehead...
Your facts aren't. Just because you have to see things in simple terms to justify your juvenile positions, doesn't mean they are simple. You routinely post links to articles (including op eds) and treat them as fact. You either do not read them beyond the openning sentences or you cannot put them in context of larger events and ideas...or both. Cursory readings of your articles have yielded enormous harvests of emptyheadedness. One example, you cited the soon-to-be released McClellan book as purportedly accusing GWB et al for deception in the Plame affair. Really, Canuck? Did you read the supposed excerpt? No mention of that situation period. Maybe that is why no one is running with this bombshell. This happens A LOT on your side.
1. I am not a Republican. I am right-wing. You, as known bigot, cannot or will not differentiate between one who is religious, one who is an extremist or a zealot. I take your epithets as complimentary, since I am very comfortable with my God.
2. Thank you for the acknowledgement. You have no idea what I would do...but, my framework would be to WIN THE WAR. You have made it abundantly clear what yours would be and what your craven motivations would be. Some people do things that are necessary regardless of what others think (anathema to you) or what we would like to do (same).
3. I would suggest you get more info than from the internet movie and anti-christian blogs. The connections to Horus and Mithra are silly, Canuck. You would know this if you did some looking. (Samuel Sandmel). Bt, since the movie fits your worldview, no questions need to be asked. That is why you are an unthinking cretin. (Versus Mako who might be a thinking cretin.)
4. What civil war? This is what happens in times of war, Robin. How many have left due to AQI? (Gosh, you keep getting smarter and smarter.)
5. I will agree that the US Gubment doe not appear consistent. However, you, brainless nightshifter, need to look at each situation individually and ask yourself: What is our interest(s)?
You simply lump all other countries into a single set of categories and argue from there. Pakistan and SA, as examples, have internal strife that has nothing to do with the US. (Your article said so, dunder.) That is why we have not taken certain kinds of actions. Iraq di not have those types of conflicts within their borders AND they had a dictator who had designs on our destrution, economic means to carry out some of it, and connections to like-minded people. SA and Pakistan do not share that at the top. (Careful here...your IQ is rising again.)
BTW--if you are so morally outraged (I know, I know...you can't be) AND you have such a strong majority of people who think like you, why can't you muster up the courage (hehe) to do something about it?! (That question just answers itself, doesn't it)
6. You are so smart. Yes, the US Gubment chose sides in a war in the 80's; something you do not have the temerity to do. You can only oppose and then give your back to the victors. Given the times (Iran's open hatred for the US and the west) and Iraq's apparent openness to westernization (see my contextual links to Saddam's French connection), it was probably the better decision to make, with the world's interest and need in ME oil. (Go back an read what the right thought about helping out Sddam then.) Until you put things into context, you will always be in the position you are in: ignorance.
On an interesting note: You have railed against the supposed lying and dishonesty of GWB and his lackeys. How can you do that since you have been willing to lie in order to propagate your position?
(I only used a medium sized skillet this time...no need for the old fashioned one today.)
Just a guess: Your friends in Germany don't have such a good time. Due to certain history we do actually have laws against right wing extremists here...
I see...citing a one bad (read: awful) incident as proof for your side of the argument.
Little boy, you are brilliant. I suppose if you take a test at school and get one wrong, the teacher should throw out everyone's exams, including yours and conclude that exams are bad because we all don't get them 100% correct.
It's indicative of a far more serious problem that's endemic, and will only get worse so long as there are those like you who sit there and say "Oh it's not that bad!"
LOL- "First they tired of Al-Qaeda’s beheadings, bombings and strange demands, such as a ban on salads containing (male) cucumbers and (female) tomatoes, and on ice cubes because the Prophet Muhammad never had them."
Religion! This is the same as the Evangelicals except it would be male vegetables co-mingling with other male vegetables. Let's all start killing each over the salad components.
Pod...evry once in a while you say something really insightful
This was not one of them. Please don't lump all religions in the same pile. Christainity is and has always been one of voluntary submission. Islam, by its prctice and definition, in not.
C - I think he means submission in the spiritual sense. But the highly religious always remind me of that episode of Star Trek with the 'will of Landrue'
B. These are the types of people you, YES YOU, are defending. I mean, how dare we undermine that kind of thinking.
Canuck...war causes people to choose sides. As a war progresses, those same people often vascillate from side to side as they weigh what they want NOW versus what they want LATER. The operative is choosing sides.
Feel free to choose the side of democracy...the little guy...independence...and WIN a war.
Canucked in the head-
I see you have decided on a new tactic: Not a war, an occupation. Like when you sit in your chair at the mall...an occupation. Tell that to our GI's.
BUSH NOR ANYONE HAS EVER SAID IT WAS STABLE. What you paraphrased he said, he probably did and would have been correct in doing so. You may play fast and loose with your words, not me.
I did answer your question. Read it again. It is just not the answer you want. It was the question that is per usuum, stupid.
Bush has stated that Iraq is a sovereign nation. Why is it then that when the Iraqi government demanded that Blackwater leave their country over and over again, they still remain. As a supporter of the new Sovereign Democratic Iraq the US should be doing everything necessary to help the Iraqi government remove the scourge of Blackwater from Iraq.
Hmmm, I wonder why Washington does not remove Blackwater from Iraq?
You cannot distinguish between "criminal" prosecution and "combatant" prosecution.
I suppose you didn't know that civil prosecution, for example, operates on a different set of evidentiary guidelines that, say, criminal ones.
Had you known this, you would know that war time prosecutions have NOTHING to do with criminal ones. That is the big dispute right now by those on the left and right...the lefties want to prosecute a war like they prosecute crimes.
DUMB
What court do you appeal wth the Gitmo bunch? What thresholds of evidence?
You are a miracle...whether you believe in them or not.
1. Repeating again (see, you STILL can't punch a hole through this one): Religious extremist elements in the countries I've mentioned have killed more Americans in the last four decades, than Saddam EVER did in his tenure. And you STILL are okay with this and/or otherwise rationalize it. Why do you hate your fellow citizens so much, Stream, that you don't mind seeing religious zealots repeatedly kill them? Your words: "Pakistan and SA, as examples, have internal strife that has nothing to do with the US." (you nicely left out Libya, Kuwait, et al) Ummm...no. Wrong. DEAD wrong. They have more innocent American blood on their hands over the years because of the extremist shit they've bred/created/supported, than you have buckets to fill it in. And you blatantly give them a free pass, yet AGAIN, by putting your head in the sand. All dictatorships. ALL no damn good whatsoever, when it comes to basic human rights, tolerance or justice.
2. Your words again: "What is our interest(s)?" Finally, Stream, the REAL YOU comes out: successive Administrations do NOTHING unless it is for their OWN INTERESTS. Nice. So much for Georgie-Boys proclamations of "spreading democracy, justice, liberty and good will to all", huh? Thank you.
3. Yeah, your "gubment" DID choose sides in a war....and as per usual...it was the WRONG side, when they should have stayed the fuck out of it, and minded their own goddamn business. And what was the result? B-l-o-w-b-a-c-k. Plus, a world that's generally considered to be the most dangerous it's ever been. Thanks, George. Thanks Stream.
4. Why don't I "do something about it"? Well, considering YOU have never had the guts to put on THE uniform, I'd say YOU have a little more lacking than I do. Besides, we're talking about YOUR "gubment", and YOUR "President"; so, why don't YOU fuckin' do something about it? Trust me, if I was a Yank citizen right now, you'd be locking me up. Guaranteed.
5. "Win the war?" Win WHAT fuckin' "war", exactly? And how? The so-called "war on terror"? How will you know when you've won THAT? Will you be sitting on the deck of an aircraft carrier, looking across the table at someone who's signing a surrender document? Huh? Or do you mean Iraq? How will you know if you've "won" there? And WHO is supposed to win there? The Shiites (sympathetic to Iran)? The Sunnis (sympathetic to your Saudi friends)? The Kurds (sympathetiic to no one, and hated by Turkey)? Or George Bush (sympathetic to oil interests, and by staying there forever)? Well, Stream? Who will "win" there? And how? Who're YOU rooting for?
I know, I know...you'll just give the same old "DON'T GET YOUR INFO FROM THE INTERNET OR MEDIA!" rant; as usual, though, you're STILL unable to assail the BASICS of what I've said today...yesterday....the day before....or ever.
Extrapolate from various sources...look for the commonalities.
Remember that, Stream?
Try it.
You may even raise YOUR I.Q., beyond what they teach you at your tent-revival meetings.
BigotCanuck...
1. Cars have killed more Americans than anything you have mentioned, but we have not waged war on automobile manufacturers. I know you can see the difference because I have swatted you ove this before: The fact that people who kill Americans come from certain countries does not mean we attack those countries. If I thought you believed that, I might actually not believe you to be a coward. We have not retaliated against Pakistan or SA because muck of their leadership still wants to do business wit us and have peace with us. That doesn't mean there aren't elements in their country that disagree and act upon it. For all of their faults, there is still a glimmer of hope in both of those countries for a solid relationship. But, that could change depending upon how things go. (Why do you keep bringing dicatorship into the argument? America has never had a position based upon dictatorships.)
By the way, what would you do with dictatorships...big or small? Like Kuwait.(I know the answer, Mr. Brave and Tall.)
2. Hey Moron...spreading democacy IS IN OUR INTERESTS! I suppose you disagree.
3. I love your blowback argument. All it has ever gotten you is a consistent thumping. I notice you didn't choose sides. Hmmm...no attacks in the US since 9/11. Gosh it's dangerous. Canada is a veritable mine field. Seems to me, most of the danger resides in places where AQ is...killing and torturing the people it professes it wants to govern. Odd...in the face of ALL your brilliance, Arab nations want to come together and talk...IN AMERICA. Your Hamas pals disagree, though. (Would that be blowback?)
4. Tough words from a coward. The only thing standing between you kickin GWBs butt is American citizenry. Don't let that stop you.
cluck cluck, canuck
5. The end to this particular war will be elements of progress. We are not fighting a nation, so your question is juvenile. Like, "when will you win the war on shoplifting at your mall?" "What will that look like?" It will look like a lot less shoplifting. The mall determines acceptable levels of shoplifting, right? Catch'em. Lock'em up. But, there are still more that come. Shirley you get it now.
I doubt it.
With regard to the various interested factions: Change is already taking place. Negotiations yield all sorts of things, over time, that we cannot see right now...some good, some not so. As the war goes in different directions ( I seem to remeber to telling me the surge cannot work militarily... oops ...maybe your frames of reference need some straightening) it brings new considerations. This is why keeping focused on winning is so important. Had you played on a team sport, you'd know the importance of faith and desire in your outcome. Waterboy doesn't count.
Finally, your article: DID YOU EVEN READ IT, DINGUS!?
Here's an excerpt:
The bill aims to make a distinction between two categories of Baath party officials who have been barred from state employment since the US-led invasion of 2003 to topple Saddam.
Only senior party leaders who implemented the oppressive policies of the regime would remain subject to the ban. Middle-ranking officials not implicated in any crimes would be able to resume government jobs.
Now I know you aren't too bright, but isn't this the kind of discussion necessary. If the US gubment fell and we had to replace the mid-level administrators to keep the bureaucracy running, wouldn't the new gubment have to decide what threshold was necessary for employment AND further, how high the previous administrators could rise up the political ladder?
1. Extremists from those countries have steadily and CONSISTANTLY killed young Americans.....and you compare this to auto accidents??? You're on fucking Pluto, dude.
2. So dictatorships are good, right? They're your pals...right? Thank you for your answer.
3. You are NOT spreading "democracy"...at all. Your "gubment" is simply doing BUSINESS. It's all about money...nothing more. Hence, this is why your "gubment" still befriends dictatorships.....MONEY. BUSINESS. And WHERE, exactly, has the U.S. "spread democracy" in the last 60 years? (I'll give you Korea...that's all). Seems to me successive U.S. governments have OVERTHROWN foreign democracies, simply because they didn't jibe with Uncle Sams business interests (Iran, Chile, El Salvador, Ecuador, Hawaii, etc.)
4. You never wore any type of uniform, and you call ME a "coward"? Ummm...right.
5. MY question is "juvenile"?? Listen: YOU are the one who said you wanted to "win the war" (exact quote). YOU said that, asshole. It's not that MY question is "juvenile"; it's the fact that your STATEMENT is asinine. And now you back-peddle. Moron.
6. The U.S. admitted it made a HUGE mistake in dismantling the Ba'athist factions, as well as the Iraqi Army. Now they're crying for them to return. Boo-Hoo.
7. There was NO Al-Queada in Iraq, prior to George and Dickface going in there...got that? And the "AQI" has NO relation, bearing or connection to Bin Ladens outfit. SURPRISE! Yes! Yet another George-made enterprise!
8. STILL haven't answered my question: WHO is supposed to "win" in Iraq? And how will you know when you've achieved it? Who ya rootin' for? Or don't you know what SIDE TO TAKE?
9. The "American Citizenry", huh? You mean the same citizenry that's gonna wipe out him and his entire Republican bloodsuckers out, come next year? You mean THAT citizenry? Okay. Gotcha.
So killing US Americans is the same as a traffic accident if it is done by countries that do good business with the US government.
And if you do good business with the US they also give a damn how you run your country. Saudi Arabia is a very oppressive monarchy with lots of very poor people and a caste of super rich, Pakistan is theoretically a democracy, but practically a dictatorship. Nice friends.
Is this what you meant by "winning"? Georgie-Boy wanting all of Saddams crew back in the government, and the Shiite parliament telling them AND Georgie-Boy to shove it up there asses?
Oh okay.
I get what you mean by "winning" now.
Ummmm....errrr.....no.
I don't.
Sounds like a pure fuckin' mess to me, man.
Still looking for the "humanitarian" angle, though.
You came out of retirement way too soon, Podman. There have always been people in government who want to return Iraq to more or less it was in Saddam's day..at State, CIA, Justice and Congress. They are called democrats.
In light of Bush's steady drumbeat for war with Iran, Kucinich said he will consider an impeachment resolution against him.
"Impeachment may well be the only remedy which remains to stop a war of aggression against Iran," he says.
"This is an attempt by the president to have the final word on his own constitutional powers, which eliminates the checks and balances that keep the country a democracy. ... That's a big problem because that's essentially a dictatorship," Fein said.
The real question for this period up to the 'elections', is:
Will GWB attack Iran to spite the Dems, and support greater oil and war profits for his Arab Allies, and himself. The only thing holding him back is some political power from below.
And if GWB decides to 'run' for president again this term he would most certainly 'win', the 'election' again, regardless of any law that allows for two terms.
Stream I don't recall us having friends in Saudi Arabia. The Saudi Family is split down the middle between modernists and Wahabbists, but Asswipe wouldn't know that as you don't read that until page three of most reports. SA could go either way, but unlike most countries, there are few there worth saving.
The SA Religion Police were designed from the types of jack-booted control Her Ladyship, and apparently all these other cretins, prefer...as long as it's not their ox being gored. In other words, they're secret police, Gestapo-like. I don't know of any church or church organization in America that has ever even tried to scale those heights. of mind or body control. Sort of makes Sunday Blue Laws look pale.
Answer the question as to why these guys would infer that sort of society to be best for them while saying openly they hate it among their enemies, and you unlock the key to their hearts and true intentions. Even as Terror-Symps they're cowards...they don't believe in what the Terrorists are for, just what they want to destroy. Back to Arabs, (I like Persians much better...it will take Her Ladyship a week to work that one out), a famous British diplomat in 1921 said of the Saudis that "they think sitting around a table and making decisions is noble, but they think doing any sort of work to know how to decide things is ignoble...hence the problem." Sort of reminds you of this crew, doesn't it? Bloviating is cool, but actually learning how to think and analyze is stooopid. So hire Google to do that for you. If I'm the money cage at glumbert, what's not to like about the Saudis?
Canuck, child...I love you.
I love that you change topics and argument frameworks when you are gutted.
I love that you are a coward who does not have the will to win a war.
I love how your inability to think keeps you gaining your education on the internet.
I love how you cannot contextualize any of your arguments.
I love how you put words in my mouth.
I love how you waller in your own bigotry.
I love how you relish our soldier's deaths.
I love how you think that if I support a policy of GWB I must be religious, right-wing, Republican redneck.
I love how, because you cannot think, our NOT bombing Saudi Arabia et al, we must be their bestest friends.
I love how, because we haven't bombed them and others, we assuredly must support every aspect of their governments.
I love how you cannot articulate what you believe. Ever.
I love how the most elementary basics of logic escape you.
I love how you never answer my questions. Ever.
I love how you make stuff up to further your agenda.
I love how you don't even try to apologize for open bigotry or hypocricy.
I love how you cannot read...especialy when you don't read the articles that you cite.
I love how you continue to cite those articles even when I hit you over the head with them.
I love how you are being supported by that beacon of democracy and sage of US HHistory, theBuggered. (Bug, babe...where's my history lesson?)
I love you, man!
Couple things...Leaders of AQI have been in Iraq before the war and had established contacts, etc. Old news.
I suppose that anyone who has never worn the uniform must be a coward...or, conversely, people who wore it are, by default, brave. (Would that include the deserters you cited?) No, CanuckedUp, you are a coward for not defending the defenseless or actively engaging an enemy that openly wants you dead. You are coward of the worst kind...you deny the evil that would take your head in front of kids in order to justify your own biases. But, on you C, it looks tough and strong.
I see you do not understand the Iraqi gubment battle over the Ba'athists. My example too much for you? Sit on it a while. (Prediction: ba'athists will be allowed back in--the mid level types--but have no real room to move up the power system.)
You missed the analogy of automobiles and our lack of military incursion into SA. (Wait, of course you did...which is why you didn't address it.)
Captain Context...name some of the countries that have benefited from US influence vis a vis the military. (I know you can do this, honey. Try real hard)
Hey, keep barking up the impeachment tree. I am all for it. Because, clearly, it is obvious. (Kucinich to the rescue! On Leahy, On Murtha...)
Listen dufus...the war is not with the Sunnis and/or Shia and/or the Kurds. That is why we don't have an immediate dog in those hunts. Or, don't you get that. No back pedalling here. Just that you asked a stupid question in order to frame the answer a certain. (Oh, BTW--I love how you do that, too.)
Your 40% Saudi article...did you read it, dingleberry? I notice you left out the good news. See, Canuck, in battle, it is will that wins. We, I hope, have the will to see this through as the lanscape in the ME changes. You are stuck in your notions...What happens if things continue down this current pah of success? Waht happens if the war is instrumental in settng up some milemarkers for this Peace Summit? What happens to your side? You have a lot of vested capital in the US losing.
Want to lay a little wager on the Presidential Election?
Stream, for a self confessed man of religion, you certainly can be rather un-Christian at times. Wasn't it Jesus who taught us "thou shalt not be a pompous gasbag"(or maybe it wasn't him, but you get the point)
Notice how he comments about the "U.S. losing"? As if this were all still some kind of "war" with clear definitions of "winning" and "losing"? Or a clear definition of who's the "enemy"? (Which he STILL hasn't answered as to who fits that bill, I might add; maybe he truly doesen't know, come to think of it, and is too ashamed to admit it?)
The man's living in a self-perpetuating John Wayne movie, I swear.
Hey stream! (watch this Billy-B!):
You like to give your Saudi/Egyptian/Pakistani/Kuwaiti pals a free pass on killing American kids, because you claim that the countries they're from (that fostered and produced them) aren't at fault. Never mind that they've killed more Americans abroad over the last 40 years than anyone else COMBINED. But you say it's not their fault, right? Okay.
Why did the U.S. (and other nations) invade Afghanistan?
Billboat...you are correct. I do not suffer fools lightly.
(I only imagine myself in the Temple laying waist to the bartering tables and sacrifices for sale. I know it's a rationalization, but it makes me feel better.)
Canucklehead...
I have not said what you paraphrased. You are too simple and self indulgent to see the differences. (Sigh) We have been down this road before and I have expalined on other threads. Iraq's official state position on the US was destruction...that was from the top, Saddam himself. Couple that with pursuit of WMDs, however primitive, thwarting ALL UN sanctions (now there is a practice that yoelds results), funding suicide bombers, and know connections to terrorists. Not too shabby a-set of reasons to at least consider attacking. I seem to remember the yellow snake himself, Bill Clinton, singing from that very hymnal. Oh, then 9/11.
Afghanistan...that's where UBL went. Remember the Taliban. Or, should we have not gone there either. Speaking out of both sides of your mouth doesn't make you twice as smart. (Also, remember HOW we waged battle in Afghanistan.)
Sooooo....."Afghanistan...that's where UBL went. Remember the Taliban. Or, should we have not gone there either."
When a nation harbours/supports/or otherwise encourages them (vis-a-vis a lack of action) a group of SAUDI ARABS who slaughter Americans, then that "nation" is ripe for invasion (according to you).
BUUUUUT.......that same principle does NOT apply to OTHER nations (i.e. Saudi Arabia, Egypt, Pakistan, et al) who not only do the same thing, but actually BREED these murderers, who have been doing this shit for DECADES, to young Americans abroad. HABITUALLY. CONSISTANTLY.
Stream?
You're a terror-symp, who's in love with Saudi Arabia, and all of its radical elements/neighbours.
That was a very CLEAR checkmate.
(and how many Afghanis and Iraqis were on those 9/11 planes? Ummm...errrr...lemme see......OH YA! ZERO! ZILCH!)
I told you Stream, Her Ladyship is not a pacifist. Says "f**k"way to much. Besides most decent pacifists actually study up to know what it means to be one. This peckerless-male is a bone fide "I wish the terrorists would win" supporter. He's as pro-war as I am, just on the other side, as I've said all along. Chumm had him nailed from the gitgo. Being a minority on Glumbert is sort of a good thing, don't you think?...although I think even here, the gap is narrowing. Unless you want to remind third party readers what's going on with this Feeble Mind, remember, the only place he has true listener is when he's on the pot. Cheers
So when this "dissenting" government says "Get the fuck out anytime; we don't need you" (like they already have) ....then Georgie-Boy will leave, right?
Don't be offended by the "Georgie-Boy" famaliarity, Stream. After all, His Ladyship has exchanged secret supplications of the heart with the Prime Minister Hisself. Remember that tale? Wonder what will happen when he calls God "G-man" to His face? Big laughs all around.
Oh, Ding-a-ling, ding-a-ling, Woof Woof! Keep it up You've taught her a lot about research. Now if maybe she can learn what to look for when reading. it's called critical analysis. hahahahahahahaha Burp
What ya think, Stream? Ya think Georgie-Boy will back his buddy, Mushariff, and tell these folks who want DEMOCRACY to suck an egg? Think he'll srick with the DICTATOR, Stream? Please tell us.
You have Bush confused with Jimmy Carter, Your Ladyship. Great study many years ago by Jeanne Kirkpatrick about the difference between totalitarian and authoritarian regimes. Lots of pages, no pictures and she doesn't get to the final analysis until late, so i don't think you could get there, still, it's out there. As long as you kiss up to the Castros and UN's of the world, Musharrif's pretty petty by comparison. Still, when it's over, I'm for shooting him....just as you are, i suppose. Unlike you some times are riper than others...you don't seem to think or see beyond the end of your pecker. Incidentally, you commented on my lack of Canada-experience. My first visit there was in '69 to visit a friend who'd skipped the war. I screwed some girl at McGill. How old did you say you were?
I knew Her lLadyship had a softspot for Christians, just the ones who agree with im, from line 1 to line 7. he can never read past that. I don't like Bush much either, on a whole host of things. What I do like about him are the enemies he seems to draw nigh. Same ones I have. That makes them an easier target for us. Simple Sister doesn't know the difference between disagreement and hatred. Then again, she doesn't know very much at all.
Well, you're one, that's for sure. George Bush has brought us more meat than you can imagine. He doesn't pick his enemies, they pick him. I kinda like that. In the war I'm rooting for George, provided he calls all the islamo-fascist terror-Symps in Canada as well. On the border I'm rooting for Tancredo, and against Bush. (Isn't this more confusion than you can handle?)
We know Lakoff pretty well, Stream. I'll tell Chumm The Idiot is quoting him. (I also saw above where Podman is quoting Kucinich...What's next, quoting The Onion as news source, as the ChiCom's did?) Lakoff is actually copying Chumm, i.e., how to fight the other side, but as usually accusing the Good Guys of his own conspiracy. Everything he says we are, he believes in himself....just as these baboons here. They like the sound of their own voice, but are unable to follow their own logic to its logical end...the destruction of the Constitution. Freedom for all, my ass. But these girls are just stupid. Lakoff is an unrepentent anti-constitionalist, elitist and run-of-the mill socialist. The good news, if his side wins, they will eat these cretins first, non of whom would qualify for a job as receptionist in the new regime they seem intent on seeing installed. Useful idiots.
Podman, I sometimes wonder if you're maybe from netherlands. Kucinich was a joke as major of Cleveland, and remains so. He hangs out with ET at Shirley Maclaine's house. He'd impeach Bush for wearing dark socks. He makes Jimmy Carter sound well-centered. "He's considering"?....as if he could get ten votes for impeachment. (I think he already tried it, by the way.) For you to sound like you take him seriously tells me you are even more looney tunes than Flagg....or from Europe. What a shame. I had more hope for your mind than that. Must be the full moon.
Stream, go to that RockRrdge nation cite that Her ladyship quoted. They are admittedly socialist (did Canukette miss that?) and in the same way as these girls, say they love the Constitution too but it is so flawed it has to be changed...so that it will, well you know, not be the Constiution anymore but rather a set of High School history club laws and bylaws managed by an elite group of managers. Them. Point is, those guys are a little better spoken and clearl;y better read than these morons. You may want to take a second look at it and try on some of their regular posters. I think even they wouldn't let Canuckina on..would give them a bad name,....but still, they're just as insipid. As I said, Chumm has been gunning for Lackoff (rhymes with...?) for awhile as he has an ersatz think-tank behind him and gets his name on left-wing fax talking points some.. I think Kucinich has even quoted him. His type won't let you draw him out...sort of like how Canuckeva and mako did when Chumm first posted about the Constitution some weeks ago. Took to the dark under their bed right away, sending poor old Flagg out with his hat in his hand. That's the way UBL sends out his suicide bombers...only more tame. Lackoff's the same way. But his minions are red meat.
Like i said before, you little bitchs! I'm no pacifist,and You're a bunch of little turds who hide behind a computer and talks like sniveling coward's, calling people what you yourself are most guilty of!
LOL!! The funniest part of your pathetic post is when you two or three closet cases join in (TRYING to make sense!) So Sorry charley! Its not happening. And by the way, This old man could take the three of you and make you look the part you play on this site. I would say the three stooges but i really like those guy's!
So then perhaps just slapping you silly, and the great part about writing that down so you can see it is ...you know it to be true! :) Line you all up then slap all of you at the same time. LOLOLOLOL!
So let us refer to you three as the three closet queers! That sounds about right. Try not to get the word queer mixed up with the term for gays! cause its not.
I would never insult the gay community by bunching you in there with them! But rather I choose to categorize you as the three closet queers. Queers being the key word here! LOL!
Yours is a semi ripe asshole but after all the buggering you're receiving. Well, you know! the echo's will just last so much longer. LOL!
Hey Chumm lets attack now. I will see if Chumm can do something about it. Hey Chumm I don't know if am I talking to myself? I don't know I will have Chumm look into it. Chumm you, me and I are gods army right? Right you are Chumm! We know that everyone on glumbert and the entire earth are dumb ass terror simps? Yes I agree, how about you Chumm? It should not come as a suprise that I agree... cha! cha,cha,cha.
Hey Chummin'! Well, what do ya know. A friend of mine sends me this video and I stummble on to some your retorts. I had to sign up just to comment. Its an honor and a privledge to find a like-minded smart-ass intellectual who knows his history and can contextualize while at the same time ripping into liberal simpletons. Just wanted to say, I'm with ya, and thank you for your ascerbic wit....rjs
cmon, I have a life. Not like these two pathetic figures shitline and chummin. chummin seems to have a serious sexual problem, calling everyone he does not agree with a girl and thinking this is an insult.
I want to apologize. I have made a big mistake. It just now occured to me that streamlined can not be from this planet.
For a human being it is impossible to have his head for so long and so far up his ass. There is only one explanation: He must be an arseian from planet stupid which is the very last planet circling a pathetic brown dwarf in the butthead system which can be found in the swinette constellation (you don't really want to know which galaxy), the planet is known for its, um, opressive, aurora analis.
Wow, a post with as many proveable facts as streamlined usually provides...
Why is it no one likes me? Is it because my breath is bad? Or is it because I'm having sexual feelings for my fellow men who are my coworkers? Because of these feelings and no one to tell here at work I feel a bit repressed, angry, alone. Wont someone hold me? will someone please touch me like the woman my body craves to be. WONT ONE OF YOU PLEASE,PLEASE KISS ME? No woman need apply! its a mens party only!
Well I usually disapprove of copycat IDs, but in your case I make an exception. I can't tell the difference between you and the real Chummin;) If anybody on Glumbert needed a good harassing it's Chummin!
CHUMMIN POPPINS: (speaking) Of course it’s a word. And unless I’m very much mistaken, I think it’s going to prove a rather useful one. (singing) When trying to express myself, I frankly quite absurd To leaf through lengthy lexicons, to find the perfect word. A little spontaneity keeps conversation keen You need to find a way to say precisely what you mean. Superterrorsympsyouareallexpialidocious Even though the sound of it is simply quite atrocious If you say it loud enough, you’ll always sound precocious Superterrorsympsyouareallexpialidocious Um diddle um diddle um diddle ay Um diddle um diddle um diddle ay
ANYONE WITH BRAINS: (speaking) But it doesn’t mean anything!
CHUMMIN POPPINS: (speaking) It can mean precisely what I want it to! (singing) When stone-age men were chatting, simply grunting would suffice.
STREAM: Though if they’d heard this word, they might have used it once or twice.(ten thousand years ago,but six would be nice)
CHUMMIN POPPINS: (speaking) That’s right.
MRS. PALSM: I’m sure Egyptian pharaohs would have grasped it in a jiff. Then every single pyramid would bear this hieroglyph! Oh! Superterrorsympsyouareallexpialidocious Say it and wild animals would not seem so ferocious
CHUMMIN POPPINS: Add some further flourishes, it’s so
MRS. PALSM Ahhh
CHUMMIN POPPINS Ahhhh
ANYONE WITH BRAINS: nah-nah-nah-nah.
ALL GWB SUPPORTER: Superterrorsympsyouareallexpialidocious! Um diddle um diddle um diddle ay Um diddle um diddle um diddle ay Um diddle um diddle um diddle ay Um diddle um diddle um diddle ay
ANYONE WITH BRAINS: The Druids could have carved it on their mighty monoliths
STREAM: The ancient Greeks, I’m certain, could have used it in their myths but only if ten thousand years ago, hell lets just make it six .
CHUMMIN POPPINS: I’m sure the Roman Empire only entered the abyss Because those Latin scholars never had a word like this! Superterrorsympsyouareallexpialidocious!
CHUMMIN POPPINS: If you say it softly, the effect can be hypnocious.
STREAM: chummin Check your breath before you speak, for you have halitotious!
CHUMMIN POPPINS: (speaking) Oh, STREAM.
ALL GWB SUPPORTERS: Superterrorsympsyouareallexpialidocious! Um diddle um diddle um diddle ay Um diddle um diddle um diddle ay Um diddle um diddle um diddle ay Um diddle um diddle um diddle ay!
CHUMMIN POPPINS: Of course, you can say it backwards, which is suoicodiliaipxellaerauoyspmysrorretrepus.
PALMS: he made me all sticky, but it feels bloody good!
CHUMMIN POPPINS: So when you hear people speaking their minds, there’s no need for dismay. Just summon up this word and then you’ve got a lot to say.
ALL GWB SUPPORTERS: (Singing) Superterrorsympsyouareallexpialidocious! Even though the sound of it is something quite atrocious If you say it loud enough, you’ll always sound precocious Superterrosympsyouareall
STREAM AND PALMS: Superterrorsympsyouareall
ALL GWB SUPPORTERS: Superterrorsympyouareallexpialidocious! Superterrorsympsyouareallexpialidocious!
(Hrjspeleton 23 hours ago Hey Chummin'! Well, what do ya know. A Gay friend of mine sends me this video and I stummble on to some your retarded retorts. I had to sign up just to comment. Its an honor and a privledge to find a simple-minded dumb-ass moron who knows nothing of his history and cans extualize while at the same time ripping farts and singing Liberace like were simpletons. Just wanted to say, I'm with ya, and thank you for your being a nit wit....rjs
Real funny thing is tho, instead of going up top a ways to say hi to a"supporter and old friend"Who just happened to find you here, you choose to come and respond to something I print! Hmm..talking about being honest! LOLOLOL!!That's rich! And talking about jumping when I call ...Well there you are Huh!
Ivana? wasn't that someone who posted a ways back? Never exchanged words I don't think? Well not with any significance , so if that was some Alias you used,,Sorry I didn't bite! LOL!
Thanks, Randy. Never heard of the guy, but I'll pass it on. Maybe Chumm knows him, Who knows, where no one uses their own name. Chumm's after bigger fish than here. He found Canuck profane. (So do I.) That's why we're here. Cheers
I'm soooo happy. You said you might bone me if I was a man. For you I'll wear a strap-on. Or perhaps 'do a cleveland' if you'd like that.
Your type normally do.
Nice to see Glumbert's special little A.R.S.E soul chirping away like the deranged republican canaries you are... You detecting any fumes of your demise yet?
Nope? Never mind. It'll come swiftly and quietly. Rather like you do with your other half no doubt.
Thanks Fishman. Ivana is smiling right now, but says no thanks. And no, Flagg, she's never posted here I don't think.
Sorry you're obsessing over the EP, I wish you got the real point. No one really cares who's right on that, you see. I sure don't, but then again, I'm confident in my manhood. I'm also not afraid of being wrong.
Compare yourself with Stream's position on Creation. You've had a bit of fun over it, and never understood just how ridiculous you sounded. Stream's a graduate Zooologist (I think) but from a major, major university, so he does his homework. He holds to the position that the Biblical story of Creation is "plausible"...search that word. Plausible is at the low -end of the probability scale. Geologists are all over the map on the age of the earth, but all agree it wasn't formed 6000 years ago, or in one day. However, all geologists recognize anomalies that occur all the time in nature that ordinarily take thousands of years but which occur in a few days or weeks. The text books are full of them. Therefore, while geologists argue as to how old the earth is, ALL of them, except political simpletons, have to agree that a much quicker and newer geologic change forming the earth is PLAUSIBLE. What, 1%? Less? I say less. Just don't forget that 30 years ago everyone said a virgin couldn't give birth...then bingo! Science insists on humility, i.e., that scientists always take notice of the things they don't know as well as what they do. Stream argues the plausibility of the Biblical tale, and as an abstract, no serious scientist can deny him the use that one word. As an abstract, Canuck may even be able to find his ass with his hat..same odds, i guess, but you know what I mean. Still you girls have tried to crucify Stream over a single abstraction, thinking, wrongly that readers out there agree with you, not knowing you are the ones acting like fools. From Canuck, who is an avowed God-hater that's not unusual, but coming from you, it's a little hypocritical. Back to Lincoln and the Emanicipation Proclamation, and our disgareement about it. I'm a paid analyst while you're an amateur analyst, which doesn;'t mean you're wrong, but just that i have more at stake in being right. But an ANALYSIS, no matter how many facts it's based on, is never more than an opinion...even if it turns out to be 100% right in hindsight. Remember the Slam Dunk CIA told Bush over WMD's in Iraq? An analysis is NeVER a Slam Dunk, if you mean 100% certainty. Your opinion on the EP is a minority opinion, while mine's a majority opinion, that's all. I don't know of a single battle that was fought over the EP, or a single shot fired or soldier (on either side) killed because of it. I don't even know how many slaves were actually freed, as much of Kentucky and Missouri were under southern control in 1863. Therefore my analysis was and still is that it had no military value to the War. No tide was turned. But no matter, that's an opinion, and yours could be just as valid as Stream's is on Creation, as it either is or isn't, no matter what either of us think. Point is, you state your opinion as if it were a fact...which Stream doesn't do, and when you state ANY OPINION, much less an opinion that is held in a minority, as fact, then chastise your opponent, then people will call you a fool and stupid, or maybe just a 7th Grader. All will fit. The point I've been trying to make all along is that if you'd show some fucking manners, people would respond to you accordingly. If you choose not to, you'll continue to be treated as a noxious odor rising out of Canuck's arse. If you want to suck up to someone, pick out Bruce Catton, or Dale Van Every or Frances Parkman...those are men you could respect.
Stream has flunked his study and his contributions to said discussion about creationism did show that he lacks any significant background in science.
"Plausible" is not the same as "I found some idiots who believe the stuff". What you are refering to is the term "possible", though even that attribute is not applicable for most of what stream did offer in the discussion.
Your so called Slam Dunk Analysis made by the CIA was manufactured instead of based on facts and the rest of the world except for Blair and Aznar did not understand why the USA did take this bullshit for real.
Thanks A.R.S.E soul. You made little sense as usual apart from repaying Streamy with your normal reach around.
Not sure where you're getting the impression that Streamy has simply been trhinking in the abstract.
Streamy admits to a belief in a 6,000 year old earth and is adamant that there are huge holes in Evolutionary Theory which are currently resulting in it evolving its own death.
According to Streamy these holes are being swiftly made larger by the swathes of peer reviewed scientists who are jumping the sinking ship of Evolutionary Theory in favour of new earth creationism.
He is thus clearly somewhat deranged.
None of us have decried his right to have a belief in the biblical tale. What we've jumped on is his apparent desire to try and prove that biblical tale as absolute truth by retro-fitting it with poor science.
Streamy claims rightly that we all have the same evidence and he's interpreting it differently. This is fine in and of itself, but he's demonstrably using poor science to support his interpretation of that evidence.
His perpetual referencing of answersingenesis.org shows this only too well
At one point either you or one of your badly trained 'analysts' even came up with the assertion that fossils were found at the 20,000ft peak of Ararat. Not only were you wrong on both counts, but you could never admit to it.
Your attempt to show Streamy some support is nice though.
Oh...and haranging RF for not showing 'fucking manners' is a little rich. You seem unaware that people DO respond to RF positively. Very positively. It's you and your little simpleton symps they react to with disgust.
It's why you are known as A.R.S.E soul.
Now, analyse this... saw this clip on Youtube and whilst it's obviously a highly propogandist piece, I was intrigued to see people claiming that there were far fewer democrats than republicans for whom the term paedophile could justifiably be ascribed. How true is this?
I know how you hate democrats and would happily live with GWB's cock up your arse for the rest of eternity, so, if you can refute the claims made about this vid in its comments section then this would surely be a good platform to help bolster your little republican neo-con cabal right?
Oh...before I go can I put a special request in? Can you come back with some onomatopoeic words please.. you know.. woof woof, ding a ling etc
"I don't even know how many slaves were actually freed, as much of Kentucky and Missouri were under southern control in 1863."
More bullshit. More half-assed rewriting of history. I just came came back from Missouri, and even my in-laws (life-long Missourians) will tell you it was almost an even-split, as well as in Kentucky (I believe a poster named Dixieland, who lives in Kentucky, already confirmed and clarified this).
This will now mark the 12,896th time you've been wrong about something, Stream.
And everytime I see a yokel waving the Confederate Flag around, I always ask myself the same question: why would they want to proudly display the flag of the side that......lost? L-O-S-T. I dunno. Ass-backward losers.
And look at Streams posse up there, grovelling for people to show them some "manners"....LMFAO!
You just look at this from the wrong perspective. There is real losing and then there is moral losing. Stream will undoubtedly be able to explain why the south did win morally...
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